[Game] Kings vs. Pelicans - 4/11/2024 - 7:00PM PDT/10:00PM EDT (TNT)

[SacTownKid]

Going after someone else besides HB with the cap space is not “pushing all your chips in”. Even going after Dillon Brooks would had been a better gamble to improve the team. Staying put with basically the same team was short sighted on Monte’s part.

His two “big moves”, Sasha and Duarte hasn’t even proven to be rotation players, with Duarte looking downright unplayable.

The reverting back to the same old after he missed on Beal wasn't the worst move, but if he didn't know that teams starting at last deadline were jumping him, he does now. If you don't have a generational core of talent at the top end your roster your success is relative to the competition around you. Teams pushed their talent level up, period. That said, this year with Keegan playing 3 and D and a now Keon showing his fit are positives almost based on luck, now it's time to finish it off if he can. If he can't, I don't know. It might be time to look at literally pushing all chips in and that means anything not named Domas or Foxy. The problem is there doesn't look to be anyone out there worth it. The players dangling for a few seasons all pretty much got moved and yes, Monte was involved with most of them at some point. The next step is to start prepping for a partial reset. This is where those Petrie years post Webber injury come to mind. Petrie actually did a pretty darn good job at patching things together once his cap was out of hand. Monte is pretty much already there himself. His team isn't that young age wise and his cap certainly doesn't scream young. Number 1, he has to find someone to slot in the middle of his defensive duo at SG and F.

 

[Rob-The-Great]

Barnes 2 more years
Huerter 2 more years
We are paying Duarte almost $6M next year.

Yeah there is nothing Monte can do.

He signed them. There is plenty he can do. You want him to sit home and watch like the rest of us sir?

 

[iowamcnabb]

Then he should make the team better, which he didn't do in the past year. I don't know what he would do, but only resigning Monk in offseason doesn't get him a pass imo. Memphis is coming back and Houston is surely getting better. We are not overleaping any team in front of us maybe except Clippers who maybe breaking up.

He will when the right deal materializes. He can’t just do something to do something. You already have 2 all star caliber players and a rising player. There are only so many moves you can make on that scale. IMO that deal happens between this next offseason and the year after that. That’s essentially his window for a big play.

 

[SacTownKid]

He will when the right deal materializes. He can’t just do something to do something. You already have 2 all star caliber players and a rising player. There are only so many moves you can make on that scale. IMO that deal happens between this next offseason and the year after that. That’s essentially his window for a big play.

It's getting to the point where Monte has to start planning for something though. Doing something to do something might quickly escalate to just clearing some salary. If Monk re-signs and no moves are made Monte is literally at the point where he can't even use his full MLE. Not that an MLE signing is the difference but that's a place you don't want to be if you're Monte.

 

[Rob-The-Great]

Bringing in Brooks would have been a huge gamble. He is a great defender but when Ja Morant has had enough of you, you have to wonder. Plus, he is averaging about the same ppg as HB on worse three point shooting. The upgrade is going to have to be bigger than that and Monte knows it. The pursuit of Siakam and his alleged feeling that even Kuzma is not the answer says a lot about his position.

But you must understand brooks impact goes beyond numbers. He single handedly turned the rockers into a gritty team in one season. Personally I wanted brooks but that's water under the bridge now

 

[Rob-The-Great]

I don't know why I'm hoping Sasha can be our Peja. Am I wrong? Is there no hope?

 

[Mr. S£im Citrus]

Every other team he's been on has gotten farther than we have last 20 years and counting. Js

Are you changing your position? Is "farther than we have last 20 years and counting" now what's most important, or is it "getting over the hump"?

Or is "farther than we have last 20 years and counting" the aforementioned "hump"?

I don't like the idea of signing Paul George because, unlike an inexplicably large number of Kings fans, I don't think that Sacramento has even entered their contendership window yet, and I think that acquiring an older player like the soon-to-be 34 year-old Paul George forces the Kings into "win now" mode, which is somewhere they have no place being in Year 2 of this new era.

 

[Dongoodboy]

He will when the right deal materializes. He can’t just do something to do something. You already have 2 all star caliber players and a rising player. There are only so many moves you can make on that scale. IMO that deal happens between this next offseason and the year after that. That’s essentially his window for a big play.

I didn’t ask for a move to make a move. I ask for a trove to improve the team.He is paid millions to make the right deal, after one year of doing nothing , the excuse of the right deal didn’t come up doesn’t get him a pass. That’s what I am saying. Why there is 29 teams making moves out there but we can’t?

 

[The Effort Police]

I don't know why I'm hoping Sasha can be our Peja. Am I wrong? Is there no hope?

Peja was all NBA, in the MVP race, and already a multi-time All Star in the year where he was two years younger than Sasha is now.

There's no hope.

 

[iowamcnabb]

I didn’t ask for a move to make a move. I ask for a trove to improve the team.He is paid millions to make the right deal, after one year of doing nothing , the excuse of the right deal didn’t come up doesn’t get him a pass. That’s what I am saying. Why there is 29 teams making moves out there but we can’t?

So what’s the move? You don’t have many assets. You only have the assets to make one swing. You better get it right or you are screwed

 

[iowamcnabb]

It's getting to the point where Monte has to start planning for something though. Doing something to do something might quickly escalate to just clearing some salary. If Monk re-signs and no moves are made Monte is literally at the point where he can't even use his full MLE. Not that an MLE signing is the difference but that's a place you don't want to be if you're Monte.

A trade is the only way. I’m sure he has a list of guys he thinks puts us into contention. I don’t know who that is personally. If we can play top ten defense next year it might be as simple as adding a mid range or diverse scorer and getting high level shooting from our spacers. There will be a few guys shake loose either this off season or at the deadline. I’d imagine we might be in a mix as a third team in a trade if New York makes a big deal ( say Randle comes our way) Deni Avdija is another guy to watch. He’s a different archetype but imo an assending player.

 

[ockingsfan]

I don't know why I'm hoping Sasha can be our Peja. Am I wrong? Is there no hope?

I think Nemanja Bjelica level player would be the proper hope for Sasha to eventually achieve. No way he gets to Peja status.

 

[hrdboild]

If Monte trades our only assets for “cash considerations” I’ll be at the front of the line to get him fired.

IMO, it’s Monte’s fault that this team stagnated this year. He was one of the few teams with some cap space and momentum this summer and instead of trying to improve the team, he “ran it back” even though even casual fans could tell he needed to move on from Huerter and HB. Now we are going to be capped out and Huerter and HB is an even more unfavorable trade asset in trades this summer.

Barnes I understand, but saying it was obvious that we needed to move on from Huerter last summer is a stretch. His averages last season were 15, 3, and 3 and he made 40% of his threes. Generally that's a guy you keep in your rotation, even with his defensive limitations. Two things happened this year which probably make Huerter the odd man out (1) He regressed this year with his shooting from elite to below average and (2) Keon Ellis forced his way into the rotation after Monte signed him as an UDFA in '22 and let him marinate in the G-League for a year. Getting starter level production from an undrafted player in year 2 almost never happens so I highly doubt that anyone can fairly claim that they predicted this.

 

[hrdboild]

He is leading the NBA in 3 %

Not quite, but he's up there amongst the leaders.

 

[ockingsfan]

Barnes I understand, but saying it was obvious that we needed to move on from Huerter last summer is a stretch. His averages last season were 15, 3, and 3 and he made 40% of his threes. Generally that's a guy you keep in your rotation, even with his defensive limitations. Two things happened this year which probably make Huerter the odd man out (1) He regressed this year with his shooting from elite to below average and (2) Keon Ellis forced his way into the rotation after Monte signed him as an UDFA in '22 and let him marinate in the G-League for a year. Getting starter level production from an undrafted player in year 2 almost never happens so I highly doubt that anyone can fairly claim that they predicted this.

Huerter may not had been as obvious as HB, but I think most people could see he wasn't a core piece. Once a GM identifies a player as a non-core player, they should be looking to upgrade at that position, when possible. Maybe the right deal didn't come up, but I could see that Huerter was a movable piece last summer and he had some decent trade value at that point, now not so much.

 

[hrdboild]

I believe that this is why it's important that the Kings make the playoffs this season and convey their 2024 pick to Atlanta. Sacramento's most likely path to improvement, in my opinion, is to identify a rebuilding team that's willing to take on a "bad" contract in exchange for draft picks, and the Kings can't make any real deals involving picks until they regain control for all of theirs.

Is this true though? The Suns owe a pick to the Nets from the KD trade which doesn't convey until 2029. Then they traded for Bradley Beal with a truckload of second round picks and three years worth of "swap rights". If other teams can trade first round picks that are 6 years away and side-step the "Stepien Rule" by trading swap rights instead of picks outright, we should be able to do the same, right?

 

[hrdboild]

Huerter may not had been as obvious as HB, but I think most people could see he wasn't a core piece. Once a GM identifies a player as a non-core player, they should be looking to upgrade at that position, when possible. Maybe the right deal didn't come up, but I could see that Huerter was a movable piece last summer and he had some decent trade value at that point, now not so much.

I would have characterized Huerter as a moveable piece last summer too but that's not the same thing as saying "even casual fans could tell it was time to move on from him". We had him for only one year at that point and he was great for us all year. Even in that GS series where he wasn't great overall, he hit some big shots in games 6 and 7.

I also don't think he'll have considerably less trade value this summer than he had last summer. To talking heads (and frustrated fans) he does maybe, but I think (most) NBA front offices are smart enough to make decisions based on data rather than gut feeling. And even after a down year his career averages outpace his current contract. He's still a good value for what he costs and in addition to being a decent secondary playmaker he possesses the most important skill in modern basketball.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

I think Nemanja Bjelica level player would be the proper hope for Sasha to eventually achieve. No way he gets to Peja status.

and Bjelica was always sort of a fringe rotation player

 

[megapoxy]

Since it was mentioned before...

https://twitter.com/statuses/1778657799154643056

 

[SacTownKid]

A trade is the only way. I’m sure he has a list of guys he thinks puts us into contention. I don’t know who that is personally. If we can play top ten defense next year it might be as simple as adding a mid range or diverse scorer and getting high level shooting from our spacers. There will be a few guys shake loose either this off season or at the deadline. I’d imagine we might be in a mix as a third team in a trade if New York makes a big deal ( say Randle comes our way) Deni Avdija is another guy to watch. He’s a different archetype but imo an assending player.

The other thing is that Monte probably can't just hold on for a "contention" move. I mean, his targets so far weren't really game changers by themselves anyway so I'm sure Monte is pulling any trigger if he feels like it makes the team better. Randle would be awesome but truth is, that's a Keegan goes out type of move at this point. Maybe not but I'd bet he won't be cheap. Monte still has to look at damaged goods. LaVine if basically free should still be an option even though with Keon here it's not nearly as good of a fit as before. I still like De'Andre Hunter as a higher value gamble guy. Does he make the Kings a contender? Probably not. At this point Monte just needs upgrades. Specifically he needs talent consolidation at the top of his roster. Fox is 8th in scoring and the next King is Domas all the way down at 46. It's clear to see why this team is so dependent on spot 3 point shooting that's waay too big of a gap between 1st and 2nd options.

 

[ockingsfan]

I would have characterized Huerter as a moveable piece last summer too but that's not the same thing as saying "even casual fans could tell it was time to move on from him". We had him for only one year at that point and he was great for us all year. Even in that GS series where he wasn't great overall, he hit some big shots in games 6 and 7.

I also don't think he'll have considerably less trade value this summer than he had last summer. To talking heads (and frustrated fans) he does maybe, but I think (most) NBA front offices are smart enough to make decisions based on data rather than gut feeling. And even after a down year his career averages outpace his current contract. He's still a good value for what he costs and in addition to being a decent secondary playmaker he possesses the most important skill in modern basketball.

Huerter would be considered a reclamation project after having such a poor season and also coming off a season ending injury. I would be surprised if we could get equal trade value for him this summer as compared to last summer. I'm thinking that teams will be low balling the Kings to the point where Monte will be forced to keep Huerter and attempt to build back up his value before trying to trade him at next years trade deadline or next summer.

 

[SacTownKid]

Huerter would be considered a reclamation project after having such a poor season and also coming off a season ending injury. I would be surprised if we could get equal trade value for him this summer as compared to last summer. I'm thinking that teams will be low balling the Kings to the point where Monte will be forced to keep Huerter and attempt to build back up his value before trying to trade him at next years trade deadline or next summer.

It depends on what Monte was realistically asking for in trade, but Monte got a wake up call on his tradable pieces, no doubt. There are some concerns about this roster right now. It's deep, too deep. Brown is really starting to get into that mode of booting players at the back end of his rotation depending on matchups which is a value KILLER. Players don't produce well like that. Then in regards to Huerter, the Kings are flat out overloaded at the G spot. Huerter going down opened the door for Ellis. Monk went down, but him going down opened a door for Davion who is now playing that backup pnr guard role. When players get opportunities largely as a result of positional competition getting injured, it's time to consolidate because you are too heavy at the back end of your bench. Sasha hardly gets time as it is and players like that might look great on paper depth wise but waving towels means nothing to the win column at the end of the day. The good news is players like Keon Ellis and Colby Jones look like cheap and passable need fillers. That can go a long way in helping Monte get his cap situation under control.

 

[Caccia]

He's 15th in pct.

After last night, CJ McCollum is #9 in the NBA in 3-point percentage at 42.4%. Grayson Allen, whom the Kings will face tonight, is #1 at 45.6%. McCollum is also #8 in three-pointers made. I kept shouting at the big screen at Ellis, "YOU ARE LEAVING HIM OPEN!" including in transition, but the Pelicans also are good at setting screens and Ellis is, naturally, inexperienced. Harrison Barnes is the highest ranked of the Kings at #63.

https://www.nba.com/stats/leaders?StatCategory=FG3_PCT&PerMode=Totals

 

[twslam07]

The Pelicans are simply a better team than the Kings as currently constructed.

Zion, Ingram, and McCollum give them 3 legitimate go-to scoring options that all score in very different ways (McCollum from 3 and PnR, Ingram from the midrange, and Zion in the paint). We have Fox and Monk as go-to scorers.

I’d also say that Keegan and Trey Murphy are similar level players right now and the Pelicans (when healthy) have Murphy coming off the bench while we rely on Murray to be our 3rd best player in the starting lineup.

Herb Jones and Keon Ellis have similar roles in that they are 3&D players that can handle the ball a bit, but I’d much rather have Herb over Keon (and I love Keon).

Obviously, I’d much rather have Sabonis over Valanciunas but Valanciunas’ size, length, and familiarity with Sabonis’ game/moves make him a tough matchup.


Again, we were never going to be a top team without a solid 2nd option. And the question still remains…can Keegan become that player or will we need to ultimately bring in that player via a trade.

As frustrating as this season has been, there’s been a lot to like when we look ahead towards the long term future of this team:

• Fox’s improvements from 3 and on defense
• Murray’s improvements from the midrange and defense
• Finding a 3&D diamond in the rough on a dirt cheap contract in Ellis
• Monk’s continued success with his minutes increasing and teams starting to game plan for him more
• Mitchell’s improvement from 3 making him much more playable
  

If we don’t want to wait on Murray (or have lost confidence that he can be that 2nd option), we should look to add a PF with good size/length who can be a go-to option. That at least gives us Fox, Monk, and ??? as our go-to options with Murray and Sabonis filling in as our secondary scorers. That seems much more balanced and much harder for opposing defenses to game plan for.

 

[Srzly]

I have to wonder how this game might have gone if it weren’t for that terrible defensive gameplan to start the game that got us down big. It felt like we played them well after we went away from that.

I’m getting a little concerned about Sabonis. He has been a TO machine lately. Him and Fox combined for 10 TOs last night. The rest of the starters combined for 0. I found myself again wanting Len in the game for his defense.

Kudos to Barnes for being the only player to play like the playoffs were on the line. Fox also was carrying the team for a stretch but was overall really sloppy and I want a fan of the dumb foul and technical but I get that he is frustrated.

 

[twslam07]

I have to wonder how this game might have gone if it weren’t for that terrible defensive gameplan to start the game that got us down big. It felt like we played them well after we went away from that.

I’m getting a little concerned about Sabonis. He has been a TO machine lately. Him and Fox combined for 10 TOs last night. The rest of the starters combined for 0. I found myself again wanting Len in the game for his defense.

Kudos to Barnes for being the only player to play like the playoffs were on the line. Fox also was carrying the team for a stretch but was overall really sloppy and I want a fan of the dumb foul and technical but I get that he is frustrated.

I’ve said it before, but I’d prefer to start Lyles at PF when we’re facing Zion. That extra size, strength, and length is a much better defensive matchup IMO. If we ever ended up in a playoff series against NOP, I wouldn’t be surprised to eventually see that type of adjustment.

 

[Warhawk]

Since it was mentioned before...

https://twitter.com/statuses/1778657799154643056

It's also in the first year of the mid season tournament, resulting in teams playing strange numbers of games against opponents (3 or 5 instead of the traditional 4 in your conference). That's in 5 games, not 4. And I'm not interested enough to research what the record is in 4 games or if you dropped a game from the Pelicans if our total would still be the most.

 

[ppine]

Tough to beat any team in the NBA that makes 3s like the Pelicans did last night. Physically the Kings were over matched at the 4 and 5 a lot of the time. The Pels have a good inside/outside game we do not match up against them worth beans. Len had a physical presence. Sabonis was neutralized in the first part of the game by Mr. V.

I have few problems with the Kings offense. Barkeley said it best when he talked about the game as "resembling a scrimmage with little defensive intensity." I have not seen that many games this year, but the Pelicans exposed the Kings' defensive problems brilliantly. The team and whole staff needs to review a game like this and figure how to prevent teams from scoring 35 points in a quarter so easily.

Brown is a good defensive coach. Listen to what he has to say in the upcoming draft and possible trades. The Kings have turned their fortunes around and are playing winning basketball, but just making the playoffs in their Conference is going to be really tough for the foreseeable future. Defense is the key, like it always has been.

 

[Srzly]

I’ve said it before, but I’d prefer to start Lyles at PF when we’re facing Zion. That extra size, strength, and length is a much better defensive matchup IMO. If we ever ended up in a playoff series against NOP, I wouldn’t be surprised to eventually see that type of adjustment.

I agree. I would much rather have seen this approach vs what we went with (for far too long) last night. It makes me wonder if the only reason we didn’t was simply to keep the same starting 5? It’s like we were trying to fit a square peg in a round hole to start the game.

 

[joemama]

He signed them. There is plenty he can do. You want him to sit home and watch like the rest of us sir?

Nope, he can watch from nice seats.
I'm saying with contracts like that his hands are fairly tyed.