Wimbledon

loopymitch

loopymitch

All-Star
#1
#1
My favorite tournament of the year starts in about an hour and a half. Unfortunately this will be Agassi's last year playing on the lawns of the All England Club:( He has announced that he will retire after tha US Open. He will be greatly missed. I still remember the kid with the long hair and the denim shorts who burst onto the scene and it will not be the same without him.
Federer is the #1 seed of course, can anyone beat him here? It will be tough. Roddick's ankle is still suspect but he badly needs the points of a good result here or could fall out of the top 10. I'm rooting for him at least to get the finals. Blake had a good result getting to the final of a warm up tournament on grass and he's looking good right now. He is the #8 seed. Can Nadal win here? Unlikely but anything is possible, although I would love to see it.
On the ladies' side, it is very wide open. Hingis is playing well as is Henin and Vaidisova who had a nice run at the French,and there's always Venus,Kim,Amelie and Maria.
 
Amanjoy

Amanjoy

Bench
#2
#2
loopymitch said:
My favorite tournament of the year starts in about an hour and a half. Unfortunately this will be Agassi's last year playing on the lawns of the All England Club:( He has announced that he will retire after tha US Open. He will be greatly missed. I still remember the kid with the long hair and the denim shorts who burst onto the scene and it will not be the same without him.
Federer is the #1 seed of course, can anyone beat him here? It will be tough. Roddick's ankle is still suspect but he badly needs the points of a good result here or could fall out of the top 10. I'm rooting for him at least to get the finals. Blake had a good result getting to the final of a warm up tournament on grass and he's looking good right now. He is the #8 seed. Can Nadal win here? Unlikely but anything is possible, although I would love to see it.
On the ladies' side, it is very wide open. Hingis is playing well as is Henin and Vaidisova who had a nice run at the French,and there's always Venus,Kim,Amelie and Maria.
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I don't see anyone knocking off Federer. He seems to quickly becoming another Pete Sampras on grass. Seeing Agassi's last hurrah should be fun, but sad at the same time because that officially makes me in my young age feel old. He's the last tennis player from my childhood that's sill around. I guess that comes with growing up! Roddick on grass is tough with his serve, but I think it's more mental with him than anything else. His ankle has been bothering him, but he's an American, he's tough. He just sometimes gets out of it mentally and makes stupid mistakes. He reminds me of a young Agassi: Brilliant most of the time, but sometimes just downright ugly!

As far as the women go, I think Henin-Ardenne has got a great shot, but never count out the big servers like Venus. I always support Hingis though.

It shold make for a fun tournament.
 
Kajun

Kajun

G-League
#3
#3
Agassi would be the last player that Roddick resembles.

Agassi has way more talent, Roddick is more of a hard worker (more a Courier type...but with a big serve). I've never really seen Roddick play a "brilliant" match either.
 
Amanjoy

Amanjoy

Bench
#4
#4
Kajun said:
Agassi would be the last player that Roddick resembles.

Agassi has way more talent, Roddick is more of a hard worker (more a Courier type...but with a big serve). I've never really seen Roddick play a "brilliant" match either.
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I think he played an overall brilliant tournament in the 2003 US Open when he won it. He wasn't dominating, but he had his moments...and let's face it...if you win a grand slam...it's because you played more brilliantly and got the breaks versus your opponents.

Agassi is a scrapper like Roddick in many ways. Agassi work mainly off of return of serve and solid groundstrokes with the ability to rally you to death. Roddick is the same when not on serve.
 
Kajun

Kajun

G-League
#5
#5
Amanjoy said:
I think he played an overall brilliant tournament in the 2003 US Open when he won it. He wasn't dominating, but he had his moments...and let's face it...if you win a grand slam...it's because you played more brilliantly and got the breaks versus your opponents.

Agassi is a scrapper like Roddick in many ways. Agassi work mainly off of return of serve and solid groundstrokes with the ability to rally you to death. Roddick is the same when not on serve.
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I guess I have to disagree.

He won the US Open 2003 because he was better than his opponents. But "better" does not equal "more brilliantly". To me, there's really not much brilliance, if any at all, in his play. He uses his power on serve and forehand to win matches. He's got an ugly backhand, and really should avoid going to the net. Because he can't volley at all.

You compared him to young Agassi. But there's a huge difference between Agassi pre 1997 and Agassi post 1997. The post 1997 version does grind it out, relies on his footwork and stamina, and the ability to make few mistakes. That Agassi would let his opponent run left and right.

The pre 1997 Agassi was brilliant. Look at his 1995 year. It might not be his best year results-wise, but playing wise, it probably was. Incredibly aggressive from the baseline, able to hit spectacular winners from both wings.

Agassi had the best return of serve during his time, but Roddick struggles with his return. Roddick does not have "solid" groundstrokes either, and certainly can't rally you to death. He hopes to stay in the rally with his backhand, and if the opportunity comes up, take over with his forehand. But even that seems to be not working as well anymore recently.

Roddick plays more like Sampras did (but even that seems a bit off), but is not nearly as talented and complete.
 
Amanjoy

Amanjoy

Bench
#6
#6
Kajun said:
I guess I have to disagree.

He won the US Open 2003 because he was better than his opponents. But "better" does not equal "more brilliantly". To me, there's really not much brilliance, if any at all, in his play. He uses his power on serve and forehand to win matches. He's got an ugly backhand, and really should avoid going to the net. Because he can't volley at all.

You compared him to young Agassi. But there's a huge difference between Agassi pre 1997 and Agassi post 1997. The post 1997 version does grind it out, relies on his footwork and stamina, and the ability to make few mistakes. That Agassi would let his opponent run left and right.

The pre 1997 Agassi was brilliant. Look at his 1995 year. It might not be his best year results-wise, but playing wise, it probably was. Incredibly aggressive from the baseline, able to hit spectacular winners from both wings.

Agassi had the best return of serve during his time, but Roddick struggles with his return. Roddick does not have "solid" groundstrokes either, and certainly can't rally you to death. He hopes to stay in the rally with his backhand, and if the opportunity comes up, take over with his forehand. But even that seems to be not working as well anymore recently.

Roddick plays more like Sampras did (but even that seems a bit off), but is not nearly as talented and complete.
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Actually now that I think about it, I see Roddick as a very raw mix between the players. No way is he as good as they were in their primes, but he shows flashes of both. He dominates on serve the way Sampras did, but shows incredible immaturity and inconsistency with flashes of brilliance the way a young Agassi did in finding ways to win ugly matches, and look good doing it. But talent-wise, he's nowhere close to either one of thsoe players. Blake is even better than Roddick.
 
Kajun

Kajun

G-League
#7
#7
Amanjoy said:
Actually now that I think about it, I see Roddick as a very raw mix between the players. No way is he as good as they were in their primes, but he shows flashes of both. He dominates on serve the way Sampras did, but shows incredible immaturity and inconsistency with flashes of brilliance the way a young Agassi did in finding ways to win ugly matches, and look good doing it. But talent-wise, he's nowhere close to either one of thsoe players. Blake is even better than Roddick.
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Well if you look at it that way, you can see a player as a raw mix of anybody out there.

Young Agassi wasn't good at winning ugly matches. That wasn't the case until Brad Gilbert took over as coach. Young Agassi was mentally weak; though Agassi has kept that knack of losing his confidence quickly (which you could immediately see in his eyes, with that puppy look of his), it was much better as he got older.

Roddick just relies so much on his power. Once his opponent is able to neutralize his power to an extent, Roddick is left with an above-average game, but really not much else. His serve and forehand are mostly about power, and not so much placement.
 
loopymitch

loopymitch

All-Star
#8
#8
Interesting match with Nadal right now. He's losing to Kendrick, an American qualifier, down 2 sets. Of course Rafa is not a grass court specialist but this is a qualifier. Normally I'd be rooting for the American but I love Rafa. Kendrick's serving very well. 20 aces so far and Rafa has no answer for him right now.
 
loopymitch

loopymitch

All-Star
#10
#10
Much as I like Rafa, I really wanted Andre to win. Very emotional moments when Sue interviewed him (I cried too). Credit to Rafa though, he played very well. His serve was awesome,especially considering he was playing one of the greatest returners of all time, he only lost 15 points on it all match. He's proving that he can play on grass. Federer may not such an easy time after all if Raf keeps this up.
It's a shame Venus lost also, this will be the first year in a long time that there will be no Williams in the final.
 
Kajun

Kajun

G-League
#11
#11
Looks like a clear path to the semifinals for Rafa...

Labadze next, who can hit wild winners, but is also wildly inconsistent. Can't expect much resistance from him.

After that, it's probably Tursunov. Pretty decent on grass, but he probably won't be a threat..

Federer's actually had a pretty tough road so far. Gasquet, Henman, Mahut...now Berdych, and what looks to be Ancic. It's just that he makes it look like it's easy..
 
loopymitch

loopymitch

All-Star
#12
#12
Another great tournament for the Americans:rolleyes: I'm glad to see Rafa playing so well on the grass. His serve has been incredible and he's actually going to the net fairly successfully. I'm not saying he's ready to win YET but it won't be long. I'm really hoping for a French final repeat. Congrats to bjorkman making it to the semis, as well as doubles and mixed. He's going to have a busy weekend. They really should have started the matches earlier yesterday to make sure they got all 4 played, the rain didn't help. It must be frustrating sitting around all day thinking you're going to play then you don't.
In the ladies I predict a Belgian will bein the final:D Yes I know I'm really going out on a limb, hopefully Kim and she will win it all.
Incredible doubles match yesterday going 23-31 in the 5th. It took over 6 hours. Talk about a battle.
 
Kajun

Kajun

G-League
#13
#13
If Nadal were to beat Federer in the final, then I'm not sure Federer could recuperate from such a blow. Clay ok, but grass..
 
Bballkingsrock

Bballkingsrock

All-Star
#14
#14
Go Nadal and Bagdhatis is SUPRISING doing VERY well on grass. As far as the womens side, I wanted Kim to win it all but hse lost so now Maursemo will iwn lol!

Dont like the womens fnial, like last eyars better but at least both of them are new!
 
loopymitch

loopymitch

All-Star
#15
#15
I'm not thrilled about the ladies final either but I guess I'll root for Amelie. She needs to win a final without Henin retiring so she can shut the critics up.
I like what I've seen from Baghdatis, if he wasn't playing Rafa I'd root for him.
The coverage this year really sucks though:mad: They showed Rog-Ancic match 3 times and then showed about 2 games of the great Bjorkman match. The same thing today, they showed the Kim match twice and we never saw the 1st set of Rafa. I'd much rather watch BBC. We've missed seeing the great matches because they have to show the "stars" at least twice.
 
Nazman

Nazman

Bench
#16
#16
Didn't have the pleasure of seeing the semi's on either side, women or men but w/ Federer facing off w/ Nada, again,l on the men's side you have to feel like it could be another incredible show. I understand that Nadal hasn't lost a match since March (yeah, you heard that right, hasn't lost in over 3 months) and of course Federer is way on top of his game and ready to get even w/ Raffie. We shall see. Americans or not this final is highly anticipated not to mention the intriguing rematch betw/ Henin Hardenne and Mauresmo who would likely like the satisfaction of an emotional match point... Stand by, Wimbledon to close on a high note...
 
KingKong

KingKong

Starter
#17
#17
Fed vs. Rafa reminds me of something akin to a Hakeem Olajuwon vs. Shaq matchup. Fed, like Hakeem, is the more talented and skilled player. However Rafa, like Shaq, is stronger, quicker and therefore more dominant. I'm rooting for Fed, as always.... but I just don't know anymore. What's Rafa's record over Fed now... 6-1. If nothing else, these two have made men's tennis very exciting again which I haven't felt since the Sampras vs. Agassi days.
 
Kajun

Kajun

G-League
#18
#18
KingKong said:
Fed vs. Rafa reminds me of something akin to a Hakeem Olajuwon vs. Shaq matchup. Fed, like Hakeem, is the more talented and skilled player. However Rafa, like Shaq, is stronger, quicker and therefore more dominant.
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That's a weird analogy. Nadal's strength is in his legs, not in his arms (even though he has that huge biceps). His incredibly strong legs allow him to run around all day without getting tired, retrieving one ball after another.

Shaq would be better compared to a player who is physically strong *and* hits the ball with incredible pace. And actually place the ball at the same time (with a bad serve though, since that would most alike to a Free Throw...). Because such a player would dictate a much (Say, Safin, but with a much more grounded head).

Don't get me wrong, Nadal is alot better than most of his opponents, but he doesn't actually dominate because he allows his opponents to play. He's daring his opponent to hit a winner, because he's confident in getting any ball back. Tennis at its simplest is a game of action and reaction.

If you don't give the opponent any time to do what he wants, and you control the action all the time by keeping his reaction time short and yours comparitively long, that is what I would see as dominating.

Wilander has said that a couple of times. Federer has the talent, but Safin has the talent (maybe slightly less) *and* the power. But then again, he may have changed his mind these days.

Also, Federer is rather quick himself. One of the best footworks in the game, if not the best. So if Nadal is faster, it's not by that much.


It will be interesting to see how Nadal fares on sunday.
 
KingKong

KingKong

Starter
#19
#19
Kajun said:
Shaq would be better compared to a player who is physically strong *and* hits the ball with incredible pace. And actually place the ball at the same time
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According to me, you just described Nadal right there. I could be wrong, but the last few matchups I've seen them play, Nadal has simply overpowered Federer, whether he using his upper or lower body. It seems Federer's skills and repertoire of shots are rendered ineffective against a stronger and agile opponent like Rafa, much like Safin (not as agle though).

I was comparing the strength and quickness of Nadal, to Federer's superior talent and footwork.
 
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Nazman

Nazman

Bench
#20
#20
Despite Federer's long standing number one ranking and his extended mastery on grass it's just too hard to bet against Nadal right now. The guy has got so much passion and strength and heart (not to mention confidence and momentum). I think the tennis world is wondering too. Is that what it takes to dominate the finesse master and renowned champion of this era. Stay tuned...
 
loopymitch

loopymitch

All-Star
#21
#21
I can't wait till Sunday. This could be the match of the year. The semis were OK, Rog. was dominant of course but the Nadal match was closer-I loved the second set. Can Rafa evict Rog form "his house"? McEnroe did it to Borg and I will have my fingers crossed.
 
KingKong

KingKong

Starter
#23
#23
You have to think that Nadal is in Federer's head though. Perhaps, Perhaps not. Federer is pretty good at keeping his composure so we'll see how they both fare Sunday. It will be electric.
 
Kajun

Kajun

G-League
#24
#24
KingKong said:
According to me, you just described Nadal right there. I could be wrong, but the last few matchups I've seen them play, Nadal has simply overpowered Federer, whether he using his upper or lower body. It seems Federer's skills and repertoire of shots are rendered ineffective against a stronger and agile opponent like Rafa, much like Safin (not as agle though).

I was comparing the strength and quickness of Nadal, to Federer's superior talent and footwork.
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Like I said, he doesn't hit that hard. I am not sure how you would define "overpowered", but "being fitter" does not equal overpowered in my book. Nadal outlasting Federer in long rallies would be a much more accurate description.

They played on clay the last couple of meetings, and clay rewards players with great stamina rather than hard hitting players.

Tennis is a game of match ups. You're concluding Federer's skills are rendered ineffective against a stronger and agile opponent. In reality, Nadal is the only one who beats him right now. And he's mostly beaten on clay, which is his best surface, and Federer's worst.

On clay, Nadal can hit extreme angles with his topspin. He also has more time to counterattack Federer's attempts for a winner.

At this point, the difference between these players is a mental issue. Nadal is in Federer's head.
 
Nazman

Nazman

Bench
#25
#25
You know it's just a mystery at this point. Who would bet the mortgage on this match? Not me. This isn't just a Grand Slam Final. This is the Second Confrontation between Two Remarkable Titans in the sport. A spectator's dream. There are good arguments going either way. Based on the available evidence it could go straight sets to Federer (home team advantage) but then again it might be a different story because of Rafael Nadal and the imprint he is making on the game. It's just hard to tell right now. And while my heart is with Nadal for a host of reasons i would love to see a 5 setter bang out last man standing kind of match...
 
loopymitch

loopymitch

All-Star
#26
#26
Anyone watching the ladies? It won't exactly go down as the best match ever;) but at least it's 3 sets. I hope they show some doubles after this.
 
Kajun

Kajun

G-League
#29
#29
DEJA VU

Federer wins first set easily again, but then loses concentration with some sloppy errors in start second set, nadal breaks, and nadal is back into the match.

COME ON FEDERER. Stop taking your foot off the gaspedal when it isn't even nearly over.

This year:

@ Dubai: wins 6-2 first set playing unbelievable, then Nadal comes back and wins

@ Roland Garros: both play horribly, Federer wins 6-1 first set, but plays very sloppy second set first service game to hand the momentum back.

@ Wimbledon: again, he plays a sloppy game at 6-0 0-0. Come on man.
 
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