Noah's attitude problems in Chicago have been severe enough that there's been talk in the press that the Bulls might like to trade him for Hawes, straight across. First suspended by the coach for talking back and showing up late all the time, then suspended another game by unanimous vote of his teammates, then reportedly in a locker room brawl with Wallace and Griffin. For a rookie, he sounds pretty big for his britches, and he clearly does not take playing for a losing team very well. Considering what things are like in Sac right now, I'm not sure that we'd want him, but his price seems to be quite low at the moment.
Joakim Noah (split from Bibby-Artest thread)
- Thread starter fnordius
- Start date
I don’t think I would want to give up Hawes away for him. I think the guy has something in him that would be good for our team…As far as Noah acting up, I only heard about his confrontation with Wallace (seeing Big Ben laugh on the bench while the team was being blown out of the game). But right now, we probably don’t need a guy making a commotion in the locker room, especially a rookie. Even if we don’t go after Noah, Gordon seems like a good guy…..We’ll see, but I would love to do a trade or two with that team.
http://sports.aol.com/fanhouse/2008/01/16/joakim-big-ben-cant-live-together/
Of course, not everyone agrees with this, and those who disagree don't tend to do so in our favor.
http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=7046
http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080118/SPORTS03/80118005/1051/SPORTS05
So... hardly a done deal, but seems possible. The biggest question is the tradeoff between drama and on-court contribution, and it's anybody's guess how that will play out.
Of course, not everyone agrees with this, and those who disagree don't tend to do so in our favor.
http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=7046
http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080118/SPORTS03/80118005/1051/SPORTS05
So... hardly a done deal, but seems possible. The biggest question is the tradeoff between drama and on-court contribution, and it's anybody's guess how that will play out.
I'm probably not in the majority here, but there's no way I would trade Hawes straight across for Noah. Hawes is not quite as athletic as Noah, but he's far more skilled. Noah has no offensive game at all. He's a terrible free throw shooter. He's basicaly a rich mans Justin W. I'm not saying I wouldn't like to have him as a player who brings energy to the floor, but long term, he's not going to be better than Hawes.
I remember on draft day a few of us actually did want Noah over Hawes, but the Bulls took him one spot before us...just noting; funny how things have changed over the course of half a season.
Regarding Noah, he's quite intriguing in that he's had a couple of nice games already, including what I believe was a 16 pt 11 reb effort off the bench recently, and there's no doubt the talent and the desire to fulfill that talent are there. But what's done is done, and stick with what we have--Hawes is showing a bit more promise out there now, and quite frankly our team wouldn't mind having a heir apparent to Brad Miller.
Regarding Noah, he's quite intriguing in that he's had a couple of nice games already, including what I believe was a 16 pt 11 reb effort off the bench recently, and there's no doubt the talent and the desire to fulfill that talent are there. But what's done is done, and stick with what we have--Hawes is showing a bit more promise out there now, and quite frankly our team wouldn't mind having a heir apparent to Brad Miller.
nope
Think back a few years when Kevin Martin was a rookie. Ever remember anybody who is so good look so lost? Spencer looks like he belongs in the league, and it takes centers and point guards more time to deveop. Spencer will be good (maybe great, but not going there yet) and needs time. Noah will never be any good offensively and will kill you at crunch time with his FT shooting. He will in retrospect have been taken too early. One of the big plus' for Noah before the draft was he was seen as a good locker room guy. Maybe he is, but there's some doubt about that now.
Think back a few years when Kevin Martin was a rookie. Ever remember anybody who is so good look so lost? Spencer looks like he belongs in the league, and it takes centers and point guards more time to deveop. Spencer will be good (maybe great, but not going there yet) and needs time. Noah will never be any good offensively and will kill you at crunch time with his FT shooting. He will in retrospect have been taken too early. One of the big plus' for Noah before the draft was he was seen as a good locker room guy. Maybe he is, but there's some doubt about that now.
Just see no real point in a straight across swap between the two.
Now if they really want rid of him and we can give them a vet to bring in a second young lottery big, then I'm down. Doubles your chances of one or the other being something, even if their respective limitations (offense for Noah, everything else for Hawes) mean they aren't likely to become franchise cornerstones.
Now if they really want rid of him and we can give them a vet to bring in a second young lottery big, then I'm down. Doubles your chances of one or the other being something, even if their respective limitations (offense for Noah, everything else for Hawes) mean they aren't likely to become franchise cornerstones.
Thing is, not sure we can give them what they want/need. Our biggest trading assets all play the positions they have, and the thing they think they need (post scoring big man) is the very thing we don't have (unless you count the obvious not ready Hawes). Back before Reef turned into Kenny-anvil part II. Maybe. Although Reef is hardly the splashy move they would look to be making.
Ah, for the good ole days of the old three way rumors of Ron out, Kobe to Chi and Tyrus Thomas to us. Seems likely we would still need a third team for everybody to happy.
Like I said, I don’t think I would straight up trade Hawes for Noah (especially since I like Spencer and his future). But to clarify why I stated I was interested in Noah. I was interested in getting Kirk Hinrich for Mike Bibby, but I was willing to throw in Justin Williams (in the trade) for Ben Gordon or Noah (especially Ben). Since Geoff was interested in drafting Noah and he’s played some nice games I thought he would be a good piece to get but not a straight trade for our pick.
I feel the Kings could get Noah, and Hinrich in a trade. We have a couple pieces they could use.
The Bulls are unhappy with Hinrich, and if Bibby were involved they would have both Bibby, and Wallace coming off the books at about the same time if it didn't work out, freeing up 30+ million or there about over two summers. We could give them Bibby, Hawes, and a #1 pick in 2010 for Noah, and Hinrich. Good thing about Hinrich's deal is that he gets paid less and less each year!
The Bulls are unhappy with Hinrich, and if Bibby were involved they would have both Bibby, and Wallace coming off the books at about the same time if it didn't work out, freeing up 30+ million or there about over two summers. We could give them Bibby, Hawes, and a #1 pick in 2010 for Noah, and Hinrich. Good thing about Hinrich's deal is that he gets paid less and less each year!
If I didn't know better, I would think your a Bull's fan. Why would we give up our center of the future, who's more talented than Noah offensivly and Bibby who is a top flight pt guard, who unfortunaly is not in our future, because of his age. Bibby is a better player, at this time than Hinrich, and Hawe's will be a better player than Noah, although a different type of player. Plus you throw away some of our future in a first round pick.
I wouldn't do this trade if they gave us a first round pick. And I like Hinrich. I would love to have him, but not at this price.
I wouldn't do this trade if they gave us a first round pick. And I like Hinrich. I would love to have him, but not at this price.
Noah is like Anderson V. on the Cavs a great hustle and worker that would be nice. From what I hear about Hawes he has great size and a nice offensive game and at only 19 should have a nice NBA career. I wouldn't trade him away unless we got Tyrus or Aaron Gray away from the Bulls. Tyrus and Noah fight for minutes big time in Chicago and Tyrus is an athletic freak which I haven't seen since we had Gerald Wallace in a Kings uniform!
Wow...hoopsworld comparing Hawes/Gray after a half year where Hawes missed training camp due to surgery. Also Gray had FOUR years of college and development whereas Hawes is one year and 6 months removed from Graduating HIGH SCHOOL. Give me a break, let the Kids play for 3-4 years before you start spouting off who's better.
People loved Gordon after one year. three years later, who would you rather have? Gordon or Martin?
People loved Gordon after one year. three years later, who would you rather have? Gordon or Martin?
