[KINGS] Comments that don't warrant their own thread (Redux)

twslam07

twslam07

Starter
#3,181
#3,181
SacTownKid said:
The Kings being a different defensive team since Keon starting is the best intel Monte could ever have. His quest for another big piece is well warranted. Keon/Keegan being the defensive backbone make this one move from as good as it gets.
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Tetsujin said:
It absolute makes a Kuzma move more palatable than before we found out Keon is a starter-level role player, that’s for sure. We no longer need to search for a guy who is both a plus defender and good enough at offense and can just look for best player available period.
Not that I would mind trading for Mikal or DFS
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I’m starting to come around on a guy like Markkanen for a few reasons:
  1. We’ve been a great defensive team lately with a Fox-Ellis-Murray-Barnes-Sabonis starting lineup. I don’t think swapping Barnes for Markkanen craters that defense. In fact, it could be better considering his size, rebounding, and ability to contest some shots at the rim. Then you still have guys like Mitchell, Jones, Edwards, Lyles, & Len off the bench that can help bolster the defense.
  2. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. Sabonis is best in a facilitator/secondary scorer role. We eventually need another high end scorer that can take the pressure off of Fox while at the same time not be a ball dominant player (allowing Sabonis to still play that facilitator role). We’re hopeful that Murray can become that player one day, but as of now, Markkanen is averaging 25.3 PTS (per36) with a .631 TS% and only has a .252 USG%.
  3. Markkanen is not only a great scorer but he allows us to continue to utilize a lot of DHO action with Sabonis. Markkanen has the ability to hit those 3s off the screen/handoff (vs. if you put a guy like Finney-Smith out there at PF). That type of movement shooting will stretch the defense that much more and open the lane up for Fox and Sabonis.
  4. Considering Markkanen’s usage is not crazy high (.252 USG%) and Sabonis’ natural instinct is to pass first/defer, I still think it allows Murray some space to continue to grow his offensive role as a scorer.
  5. Markkanen is only 26 years old and is on the same timeline as the rest of our core.

In general, swapping out Barnes for Markkanen in the starting lineup would seem to give us a plethora of offensive upgrades while keeping the defense relatively the same (if not a bit better). If we’re moving on from Huerter & Barnes and continue to play defensive guys like Ellis, Mitchell, Jones, Edwards, Lyles, & Len in their place, adding a guy like Markkanen may make some sense.
 
pdxKingsFan

pdxKingsFan

So Ordinary That It's Truly Quite Extraordinary
Staff member
#3,182
#3,182
I will probably always have a soft spork for Lauri as a UA Wildcat so I try not to evaluate these things, but he's been much better than I thought he could be most of his tenure in Utah. so I'd surely give it a try and home he give me pleasure like Bibby instead of the other Cats that have come to town and been disappointments.

I just don't see how you get him here with Ainge around. But I do see how if we had control of our picks again how he'd take them in exchange for cheap/flexible talent. One more reason to hope we can win a play in game.
 
megapoxy

megapoxy

Bench
#3,183
#3,183
Tetsujin said:
https://twitter.com/statuses/1778168579843891543
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What is not shown here and ok it's quite hard to monitor it with stats, is the fact that Kings lost many matches that had the lead early on because of hitting those 3s, but carried on shooting despite missing the majority of them from one point on. Even against the Pels it happened once this season, great start in 1st quarter but it was only due to hitting 5-6 quick 3s and then collapsing when trying to do the same without success.

Earlier in the season it was mentioned at some point I think by Kyle that Wolves and Pels had the best 3 point defense despite letting their opponents take the most 3 point shots in the league. I am pretty sure we have fallen in Pelicans traps in multiple occasions the current season looking at the results.
 
hrdboild

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
#3,184
#3,184
megapoxy said:
What is not shown here and ok it's quite hard to monitor it with stats, is the fact that Kings lost many matches that had the lead early on because of hitting those 3s, but carried on shooting despite missing the majority of them from one point on. Even against the Pels it happened once this season, great start in 1st quarter but it was only due to hitting 5-6 quick 3s and then collapsing when trying to do the same without success.

Earlier in the season it was mentioned at some point I think by Kyle that Wolves and Pels had the best 3 point defense despite letting their opponents take the most 3 point shots in the league. I am pretty sure we have fallen in Pelicans traps in multiple occasions the current season looking at the results.
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"Fallen into a Pelicans trap" is such a good phrase that I'm tempted to start working it into conversations (without context) from now on just to see if it catches on.

"Dull plastic scissors were on sale so I bought 3 of them!"
"There you go falling into a Pelicans trap again."

And so on.
 
Spike

Spike

Subsidiary Intermediary
Staff member
#3,185
#3,185
twslam07 said:
In general, swapping out Barnes for Markkanen in the starting lineup would seem to give us a plethora of offensive upgrades while keeping the defense relatively the same (if not a bit better). If we’re moving on from Huerter & Barnes and continue to play defensive guys like Ellis, Mitchell, Jones, Edwards, Lyles, & Len in their place, adding a guy like Markkanen may make some sense.
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I would not like to think that a person would tell someone he has a plethora, and then find out that that person has *no idea* what it means to have a plethora.
 
twslam07

twslam07

Starter
#3,186
#3,186
pdxKingsFan said:
I will probably always have a soft spork for Lauri as a UA Wildcat so I try not to evaluate these things, but he's been much better than I thought he could be most of his tenure in Utah. so I'd surely give it a try and home he give me pleasure like Bibby instead of the other Cats that have come to town and been disappointments.

I just don't see how you get him here with Ainge around. But I do see how if we had control of our picks again how he'd take them in exchange for cheap/flexible talent. One more reason to hope we can win a play in game.
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Yeah a couple thoughts on this…
  1. Markkanen will be an expiring next year which should lower his trade value
  2. If we make the playoffs this year, we’ll be able to trade all of our future 1sts (picks and pick swaps) again.
I would imagine our offer would be pick based (as that seems to be what Ainge covets) and some matching salary. Something like Huerter and picks for Markkanen. That would leave us with the following roster going into next season (assuming we resign Monk)…

PG - Fox / Mitchell
SG - Ellis / Monk / Duarte
SF - Murray / Barnes / Jones
PF - Markkanen / Lyles / Vezenkov
C - Sabonis

We’d probably want to try and move Barnes for an expiring so his salary won’t be on the books when Markkanen is due for a big payday in the summer of 2025. Maybe Barnes for an expiring and a 2nd(s) or something. That could leave us with a rotation of…

PG - Fox (34) / Mitchell (14)
SG - Ellis (20) / Monk (28)
SF - Murray (32) / Vezenkov (12) / Ellis (4)
PF - Markkanen (34) / Lyles (12) / Vezenkov (2)
C - Sabonis (34) / Len (10) / Lyles (4)

Fox = 34 min
Markkanen = 34 min
Sabonis = 34 min
Murray = 32 min
Monk = 28 min
Ellis = 24 min
Lyles = 16 min
Mitchell = 14 min
Vezenkov = 14 min
Len = 10 min

You could probably cut into Vezenkov’s minutes if you want to put more minutes towards a 3 guard lineup (which Brown seems to like) which would bump up Mitchell’s minutes.
 
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Mr. S£im Citrus

Mr. S£im Citrus

Doryphore of KingsFans.com
Staff member
#3,188
#3,188
hrdboild said:
Is this true though? The Suns owe a pick to the Nets from the KD trade which doesn't convey until 2029. Then they traded for Bradley Beal with a truckload of second round picks and three years worth of "swap rights". If other teams can trade first round picks that are 6 years away and side-step the "Stepien Rule" by trading swap rights instead of picks outright, we should be able to do the same, right?
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Perhaps "can't" was a poor choice of words. From my perspective, unless the Kings are trying to go into "win now" mode (which I maintain that they should not, nor should they attempt to operate as if they are), then that's as close to "can't" as makes no odds. The Suns basically mortgaged their future for a chance to win right now, and I don't think that they're going to win right now, which makes it a bad move. You can't trade for a transformational player without giving away basically all of your assets, and I don't think that there was any player on the market that would have made the difference between "first round and out" and "championship contender" for the Kings, so I don't think that a trade was worth it. I don't even think that there was a player on the market that would have made the difference between "first round and out" and "second round and out" that was also within the same age range as the Kings' three main guys.
 
megapoxy

megapoxy

Bench
#3,189
#3,189
We need more European guys coming to create more threads in case they won't be playing next season (self-sarcasm mode activated).

Mod Note -- I'm just going to move this here to keep the Prospects forum on topic. -hrdboild
 
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megapoxy

megapoxy

Bench
#3,190
#3,190
megapoxy said:
We need more European guys coming to create more threads in case they won't be playing next season (self-sarcasm mode activated).

Mod Note -- I'm just going to move this here to keep the Prospects forum on topic. -hrdboild
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It was a joke obviously that's why the self-sarcasm was even mentioned. Also I doubt there is a European prospect out there that could help. Stojakovic junior still needs time to be ready for the NBA.

Also a bit off topic, you guys have no idea how many times I had to defend MB in Greek social media in the preseason, early in the season and midseason with what he was called by Olympiakos fans or Greek reporters that were trying to create clickbait stories "why Sasha isn't playing" isolating some statements MB made in the press that made him sound disrespectful to Sasha. I guess similar things happened to Bulgaria where Sasha is from but ok let's not go through this at the moment
 
hrdboild

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
#3,191
#3,191
Mr. S£im Citrus said:
Perhaps "can't" was a poor choice of words. From my perspective, unless the Kings are trying to go into "win now" mode (which I maintain that they should not, nor should they attempt to operate as if they are), then that's as close to "can't" as makes no odds. The Suns basically mortgaged their future for a chance to win right now, and I don't think that they're going to win right now, which makes it a bad move. You can't trade for a transformational player without giving away basically all of your assets, and I don't think that there was any player on the market that would have made the difference between "first round and out" and "championship contender" for the Kings, so I don't think that a trade was worth it. I don't even think that there was a player on the market that would have made the difference between "first round and out" and "second round and out" that was also within the same age range as the Kings' three main guys.
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I'm starting to see what the problem is. If the pick Monte traded to Atlanta doesn't convey this year it's still top 12 protected next year (2025) and top 10 protected the year after that (2026) which means those picks are also untradeable as is the 2027 pick until this is resolved. (It would be back-to-back traded picks if we somehow end up keeping our pick next year too).

There is still some trade flexibility this summer though since Monte will have Lyles and Duarte as expiring contracts (about 14 million combined) and Huerter, Barnes, and Vezenkov all on 2 year deals (about 41.5 million combined). That's a lot of salary filler to potentially send to a capped out team desperate to escape from one of their large contracts. And if that desperate team is Atlanta, I believe Monte could also remove the pick protections as part of the deal.
 
Jones2006

Jones2006

G-League
#3,192
#3,192
Never posted in this thread but have a post that fits great. Saw a clip from JJ/Lebron podcasts on screen assists being underrated & how it should be in box scores so I looked up leaders in screen assists. Sabonis leads league in screen assists per game AND Len leads league in screen assists per 48 min (minimum 100 minutes played). Just interesting; perhaps both players would be viewed even more highly if this was an official box score stat. Click "Screen Assists" from link.

LINK per game - https://www.nba.com/stats/players/hustle
LINK per 48 min - https://www.nba.com/stats/players/hustle?PerMode=Per48
 
S

sactowndog

All-Star
#3,193
#3,193
Jones2006 said:
Never posted in this thread but have a post that fits great. Saw a clip from JJ/Lebron podcasts on screen assists being underrated & how it should be in box scores so I looked up leaders in screen assists. Sabonis leads league in screen assists per game AND Len leads league in screen assists per 48 min (minimum 100 minutes played). Just interesting; perhaps both players would be viewed even more highly if this was an official box score stat. Click "Screen Assists" from link.

LINK per game - https://www.nba.com/stats/players/hustle
LINK per 48 min - https://www.nba.com/stats/players/hustle?PerMode=Per48
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It’s valuable in your 3rd or 4th player. But Sabonis is paid like a 1 or 2 player.
 
Kingz19

Kingz19

All-Star
#3,197
#3,197
megapoxy said:
It's not just the Hornets that are after Jordi.

https://twitter.com/statuses/1779221592561881368
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Isn’t Jordi mainly the defensive “mastermind” on the Kings? I guess he comes with strong references because that stubborn help defense suuuccks.

I think Jay Triano is tasked with the offense and atleast last season that should’ve been the only thing of interest to other teams. It’s just funny how some names enter the head coaching rumor mill and they just don’t leave. I don’t understand why Fernandez would be in high demand.

Coach Bud should be the front runner for most vacant coaching positions but the Nets suck because they don’t have a playmaker and distributer. If Ben Simmons wasn’t a shell and played consistently they would be pretty good
 
Jones2006

Jones2006

G-League
#3,200
#3,200
pdxKingsFan said:
yeah, and his traditional stats reflect that. not sure what your point is, but I think the fact Len is also high on a per 48 basis shows this might be more of a system stat than a player stat.
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It is definitely more of a system stat - But I think it also shows Kings have 2 bigs that fit their system pretty well. Example - targeting a big low in screen assists may not wise unless they want to tinker with the system/offensive philosophy.
 
pdxKingsFan

pdxKingsFan

So Ordinary That It's Truly Quite Extraordinary
Staff member
#3,201
#3,201
Jones2006 said:
It is definitely more of a system stat - But I think it also shows Kings have 2 bigs that fit their system pretty well. Example - targeting a big low in screen assists may not wise unless they want to tinker with the system/offensive philosophy.
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Yeah I just wasn't sure why the other poster needed to reference his salary, seemed like a cheap shot.
 
Kingz19

Kingz19

All-Star
#3,202
#3,202
Caccia said:
He did an excellent job coaching the Canadian National Team. Plus, he was lead assistant to the unanimous Coach of the Year last season. Pretty good references, if you ask me.
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Yeah, there is the World Cup showing for Canada. Wasn’t thinking about that.

Kings were almost exclusively good last season for their offense. Players and coaches usually credit Jay Triano for that facet. Who is ranked just under Fernandez but doesn’t sign his name to the crappy help defense.

I’m just saying I don’t know how big of a blow it would be if the Kings lost Fernandez…but possibly I’m just very salty right now.
 
pdxKingsFan

pdxKingsFan

So Ordinary That It's Truly Quite Extraordinary
Staff member
#3,203
#3,203
Fernandez will be a loss but I think we were lucky to keep him this season and the team has been planning for it. Bigger question is how many of our other assistants might join him, as I think we have a few ready to make a jump and many of them are tied to individual player development (Luke Loucks in particular).

I am more than a little curious about Triano too, but perhaps he is happy in the Pete Carril role and not to be the HC.
 
megapoxy

megapoxy

Bench
#3,204
#3,204
Jordi will coach Canada in the upcoming Olympics, if he plays his cards well and wins a medal (will be harder than the World Cup even though Canada might be stronger with Murray, Wiggins, Mathurin, Lyles joining) more teams will need him. I think he did a good job in Denver too, that's where the whole DPOG idea came from. In case Toronto will be looking for a coach too he will be the main candidate again due to his "Canadian" influence. I don't think the Kings can keep him if he wants to take a head coach job elsewhere.
 
pdxKingsFan

pdxKingsFan

So Ordinary That It's Truly Quite Extraordinary
Staff member
#3,205
#3,205
Don't know how close he is with Keegan and the Murray family but I think Portland would be a good fit for him especially if he is settled in on the West Coast. Chance to help Kris, a team with some interesting young players who need guidance and that has finally hit rock bottom this season so that even though Portlanders seem to have some pretty high expectations he should have 2-3 seasons' worth of grace in him.

BUT, ownership in Portland remains an issue.
 
pdxKingsFan

pdxKingsFan

So Ordinary That It's Truly Quite Extraordinary
Staff member
#3,208
#3,208
All I can ask is the team competes every night and every game is meaningful and matters. The worst years as a fan are the ones when you know in your heart that losing is better than winning. That is one reason before NIL and realignment of the last 2-3 years I enjoyed NCAA sports so much because tanking was never beneficial. We are win or go home. This is exciting, even if I have tempered expectations to actually advance.
 
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