Young PFs to watch (free agency or trade)

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
#1
I'd started writing a longer post about all the options available at the PF position in free agency at the end of the season, but with the team doing so well -- and Thompson, Landry, and Evans all being key contributors so far -- it seemed appropriate to pump the breaks a bit on talk of replacing them. Instead I just wanted to mention a couple guys I'm keeping an eye on as possible off-season additions keeping in mind Reggie Evans is a free agent at the end of the year, and while we should look to bring him back, he'll be 35 at the end of the season. We also need to be thinking about adding some size in the frontcourt. So this is less about replacing Thompson/Landry/Evans at this point for me and more about looking for ways to get even better in the aggregate by adding like-minded players.

Alright, first let me explain my criteria...

Darren/Gay/Cousins is working and we have a lot invested at the SG position already with two top 10 picks in a row. My goal was to try and find the perfect player to plug into our PF spot, either starting or off the bench. My target areas were rebounding, defense (statistically measured using block and steal percentage -- not the best indicator I realize), and low usage rate. Basically a player who won't use up a lot of offensive possessions and does the dirty work down low. I ran a single season search at basketball-reference for the first 5 seasons of active player's careers for any season which combined >15 True Rebound %, >1.5 block and steal percentage, and <20 usage percentage. I also filtered out guards. Here are the results sorted by defense rating:

LINK to LIST

First, the obvious -- the top two names on the list correspond to the current season so the sample size is very small. Scanning further down the list though, you can see that a lot of the names we expect to see are showing up. Tyson Chandler, Samuel Dalembert, Chris Anderson, Joakim Noah, Andre Drummond. Any of these guys in the prime of their career would easily fit the bill.

Secondly, you can eliminate the guys near the twilight of their career. Chandler and Dalembert are still decent options, but they're rapidly nearing the point where big men lose huge chunks of the season to injuries. My goal was to find a young PF to commit to, not a temporary stopgap.

Thirdly, Thomas Robinson and Larry Sanders are off to what are likely to be unsustainable starts this year, but both have previously made the list -- Robinson in his rookie season and Sanders in his fourth, which is interesting because those were considered very poor seasons for both of them. Looking deeper into their stats, Sanders barely missed on the steals the year before and Robinson barely missed on the steals in his second season. So it might not be a fluke, both of them seem like decent bets to make the list again. That makes them players to watch this year.

Fourthly, the other young PFs most likely to fill a need for us if we can get them are Ed Davis and Gorgui Deng. Dieng is particularly intriguing because he doesn't just meet the criteria, he knocks it out of the park on every level. I also like that he gobbles up offensive boards at a high rate. You couldn't invent a more perfect player for us, alas he's Minnesota's for the next two years. Ed Davis is a per/36 star who hasn't quite had a breakout year yet, but he's been consistent about providing under the radar value for his team. Definitely worth considering.

Lastly, two mid-career vets made multiple appearances on the list and thus can't be ignored. Those two players are Amir Johnson, who is actually a combo forward so less interesting than these other guys for us, and Paul Millsap. Millsap meets some of the criteria, but not all of them. His rebounding rates are moving in the wrong direction (particularly on the offensive end) and he's headed for his fifth straight season with a usage rate over 20. His defensive peripherals are outstanding though and he can limit his shot attempts on a better team, but I feel like the price/performance balance isn't going to be in our favor. An intriguing option, but he wouldn't be my first choice. Amir Johnson is a potential Reggie Evans replacement, not the same on the boards of course, but he makes up for it in other areas. At the right price he's worth considering. Both of these guys, it should be noted, would not help our size problem down low.

So here's the list, and their contract status at the the end of the season:

Gorgui Dieng is signed next season and has a team option for the 2016/2017 season.
Ed Davis is likely to execute his player option at the end of the year and become a free agent.
Larry Sanders has 3 years of 11M per left after this year.
Thomas Robinson's last option year was declined by Portland so he will become an unrestricted free agent.
Amir Johnson will be an unrestricted free agent.
Paul Millsap will be an unrestricted free agent.

I've been stumping for Larry Sanders for 2 years now, so that shouldn't come as a surprise. I know people are going to tear into me for daring to suggest Thomas Robinson as an option, but perhaps a "not so fast" is in order? The guy does have legit size to play PF and seems to be getting better, particularly on the boards where he was solid from the beginning. Millsap and Davis are potential free agent targets in the off-season. I didn't consider Omer Asik or Greg Monroe here even though both will be free agents because I think they'll be out of our price range.

Thoughts? Who did I forget?

EDIT: Another player who met the criteria that I forgot to mention was Kyle O'Quinn on Orlando. He'll be a restricted free agent at the end of the year. I don't know much about him, I'll have to watch him play this year, but for completeness sake he should be on the list.
 
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hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
#2
Also... I left out two bargain basement options in Cole Aldrich and Tony Mitchell. Aldrich we all know, and he'll be on the market again this year. Tony Mitchell is actually the guy I wanted us to draft in the second round instead of Ray McCallum but he's only played 79 minutes in the NBA so far, so we don't really know who he is yet. The question then becomes with these two, why not just develop Eric Moreland instead?
 

kingsboi

Hall of Famer
#3
Millsap will come with a hefty price tag so I don't see him as an option. Dieng is a decent big man that takes up space, rebounds and blocks shots, I don't see the TWolves letting him go though, they are trying to rebuild properly. I'll still take Sanders, but that would probably go against our MO with good character guys. Ed Davis isn't a bad young PF but him starting? ehh I don't know about all that.
 
#4
I watched Ed Davis in a couple Preseason games and wished we had picked him up. Looked very solid. Although I think Moreland will be able to do just as much, if not more, once he comes around and gets a feel for the NBA game
 

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
#5
Millsap will come with a hefty price tag so I don't see him as an option. Dieng is a decent big man that takes up space, rebounds and blocks shots, I don't see the TWolves letting him go though, they are trying to rebuild properly. I'll still take Sanders, but that would probably go against our MO with good character guys. Ed Davis isn't a bad young PF but him starting? ehh I don't know about all that.
Thompson right now is giving us what we need in the starting lineup, so I've expanded my search to include bench options as well. Landry has some nice scoring punch coming off the bench, but dropping to the all undersized lineup when our starters come out is something we won't be able to get away with for long.

also...

The bold part was the entire list that I generated based on the search criteria I mentioned in my post and eliminating the untouchables (Noah, Drummond) the prohibitively expensive (Asik, Monroe) and the declining late career guys (Chandler, Dalembert, Anderson, Hayes, Varejao). I listed them in order of preference so yeah, Millsap is the last guy on my list and I don't really think he's worth what he's going to cost either. Not for the role he would have here. And I don't think Minnesota gives up Dieng, but we could try to outbid them in 2 years. With big Rubio and Pekovic deals in the books and an infusion of top level young talent all set to start getting expensive in 2018 and 2019, it's possible Dieng slips through the cracks.
 
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#6
Ryan Anderson would be nice. Could provide offense of the bench and has range to free up the paint for Boogie to operate (not that he needs the help...)

JT deserves a lot of love. I've said for years that he'd be a good role player for a playoff team, and he's showing it through 5 games this season
 
#7
I was really disappointed that we didn't end up getting Ed Davis...considering how little he signed for with the Lakers. I felt he would have been a great pick-up, especially if we could have gotten him for close to the price the Lakers did.
I also liked Dieng coming out of college and it's good to see he's making an impact, so I would be perfectly happy if we could pick either of these guys up, especially if it doesn't cost an arm or a leg.

With that said...I know this isn't a draft thread, but with how we are playing right now, there is no way that we hold on to our draft pick...which is a good thing because it means that we are winning.

But if I'm being honest, what I truly want when it comes to a partner in crime next to Cousins is.....

...to somehow pick up a 1st round pick in the 8-14 range and get WCS out of Kentucky. (Willie Cauley-Stein)

He's going to be this generation's version of Tyson Chandler.
He's got out-of-this-world lateral quickness and has the ability to even defend guards on the perimeter due to his quickness and length.
And the fact that he stayed another year at Kentucky could actually hurt his draft stock a bit...and he could drop to the 10-15 spot. (This is me being wishful)

Anyway, I'd give up any asset I have except for Cousins/Gay/Collison in order to get WCS. I think that Stauskas is going to end up being a good player and I am hopeful that Ben will figure it out...but I'd trade either of them in a heartbeat if it could get me WCS, because WCS would cement our defense next to Cousins for the next decade.
 
#8
Last night unfolded one of the major weaknesses of this Kings-Roster - defending the penetration from the Guards-Positions. Bledsoe and Dragic abused our Defense time and time again, getting pretty uncontested layups at the rim.
JT, while being a decent post-defender, has problems rotating on help-defense properly and just isn't a shotblocker. On top of that he has problems guarding those stretch-4's, cause he lacks lateral quickness to stay in front of them and has to back off, giving some open jumpers to them. Markieff really hurt us.
In order to balance this roster even further, i would prefer a mobile PF, who can really elevate to block shots and rebound and is quick enough to contest the perimeter game of stretch-4's.
Out of the list above Thomas Robinson fits this bill. He gives the Blazers great hustle, while staying out of the way on offense and using his athleticism on fastbreaks and help-defense. He is a bad post-defender, but versus strong PF's like Love or Griffin the Kings can stick to JT, while Robinson might provide a defensive presence versus those Guard-heavy teams with floor spacing like Phoenix.
His attitude might get into his way, but there are chances that 3 years bouncing around the league without a team really giving him full trust, really cooled some of his temper and made him a bit more humble and realistic.
He should be available at a bargain price, so there isn't much risk involved.
 
#9
Here's a name I think we were linked to in the off season brandon bass.
He's a good pick and role defender and an average man to man defender, and an excellent team defender. Also his ability to hit the mid range shot will cause havoc when teams double DMC. Career shooting from 16-23ft is 46% that's elite for a PF
 
#10
Last night unfolded one of the major weaknesses of this Kings-Roster - defending the penetration from the Guards-Positions. Bledsoe and Dragic abused our Defense time and time again, getting pretty uncontested layups at the rim.
JT, while being a decent post-defender, has problems rotating on help-defense properly and just isn't a shotblocker. On top of that he has problems guarding those stretch-4's, cause he lacks lateral quickness to stay in front of them and has to back off, giving some open jumpers to them. Markieff really hurt us.
In order to balance this roster even further, i would prefer a mobile PF, who can really elevate to block shots and rebound and is quick enough to contest the perimeter game of stretch-4's.
Out of the list above Thomas Robinson fits this bill. He gives the Blazers great hustle, while staying out of the way on offense and using his athleticism on fastbreaks and help-defense. He is a bad post-defender, but versus strong PF's like Love or Griffin the Kings can stick to JT, while Robinson might provide a defensive presence versus those Guard-heavy teams with floor spacing like Phoenix.
His attitude might get into his way, but there are chances that 3 years bouncing around the league without a team really giving him full trust, really cooled some of his temper and made him a bit more humble and realistic.
He should be available at a bargain price, so there isn't much risk involved.
I thought, at some point last night penetration was effectively cut-off. Until guys with stripes invented moving screen Boogie was even getting blocks. And then 2nd year guy showed up, while 26 year old one did a decent job on Dragic. Anyone you are able to get right now is a trade-off: either you worsen defense to improve PF shooting, or...I guess, it's hard to get less offensive production, than JT is providing right now, but there's also no clear defensive upgrades available. We'll need JT vs Mavs, cause Reggie or Carl have no chance of even bothering Dirk.
P.S. If Brandon Bass was the guy, you described, he would be sought after by PO teams. Somehow he's still stuck on a deep lottery team.
 
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#11
I thought, at some point last night penetration was effectively cut-off. Until guys with striped invented moving screen Boogie was even getting blocks. And then 2nd year guy showed up, while 26 year old one did a decent job on Dragic. Anyone you are able to get right now is a trade-off: either you worsen defense to improve PF shooting, or...I guess, it's hard to get less offensive production, than JT is providing right now, but there's also no clear defensive upgrades available. We'll need JT vs Mavs, cause Reggie or Carl have no chance of even bothering Dirk.
P.S. If Brandon Bass was the guy, you described, he would be sought after by PO teams. Somehow he's still stuck on a deep lottery team.
Well it should not be JT OR an athletic, quick held defender, but JT AND this type of player, so that Malone can choose who gets major minutes depending on the matchups and opponents playstyle. We did a good job in the 4th, but Bledsoe and Dragic still got to the rim frequentely. JT had a tough time trying to guard Markieff, who thankfully fouled out. It was Landry, who did a great job closing out on Shooters in overtime.
I guess if this type of player is available for a cheap contract, the Kings can upgrade their roster. Our PF are all somewhat slowfooted. So why not aquire a great athlete for this position, who still develops his game?
In my humble opinion the Kings gave up on Robinson too early. The kid is an athletic freak, who does pretty well for Portland, if given playing time and focusing on hustle plays and running the floor. He clearly took a step forward since his time in SAC and pretty much knows his limits now. Eventually the same narrative like the Casspi-signing might be possible.

You dont need the post-Defense of JT against stretch-4 guys and due to his lack of offensive game, JT can't punish those weak, soft PF on the other end of the floor.
 
#12
Well it should not be JT OR an athletic, quick held defender, but JT AND this type of player, so that Malone can choose who gets major minutes depending on the matchups and opponents playstyle. We did a good job in the 4th, but Bledsoe and Dragic still got to the rim frequentely. JT had a tough time trying to guard Markieff, who thankfully fouled out. It was Landry, who did a great job closing out on Shooters in overtime.
I guess if this type of player is available for a cheap contract, the Kings can upgrade their roster. Our PF are all somewhat slowfooted. So why not aquire a great athlete for this position, who still develops his game?
In my humble opinion the Kings gave up on Robinson too early. The kid is an athletic freak, who does pretty well for Portland, if given playing time and focusing on hustle plays and running the floor. He clearly took a step forward since his time in SAC and pretty much knows his limits now. Eventually the same narrative like the Casspi-signing might be possible.

You dont need the post-Defense of JT against stretch-4 guys and due to his lack of offensive game, JT can't punish those weak, soft PF on the other end of the floor.
Those stretch-guys seem to be our weak spot right now. Hawes caused some problems on the defensive end versus the Clippers. Darell Arthur put up some numbers against us. Markieff got the best out of JT. And there are a lot of those Stretch-4/5-Guys out there around the league. We need to do a better job guarding them.
 
#13
Well it should not be JT OR an athletic, quick held defender, but JT AND this type of player, so that Malone can choose who gets major minutes depending on the matchups and opponents playstyle. We did a good job in the 4th, but Bledsoe and Dragic still got to the rim frequentely. JT had a tough time trying to guard Markieff, who thankfully fouled out. It was Landry, who did a great job closing out on Shooters in overtime.
I guess if this type of player is available for a cheap contract, the Kings can upgrade their roster. Our PF are all somewhat slowfooted. So why not aquire a great athlete for this position, who still develops his game?
In my humble opinion the Kings gave up on Robinson too early. The kid is an athletic freak, who does pretty well for Portland, if given playing time and focusing on hustle plays and running the floor. He clearly took a step forward since his time in SAC and pretty much knows his limits now. Eventually the same narrative like the Casspi-signing might be possible.

You dont need the post-Defense of JT against stretch-4 guys and due to his lack of offensive game, JT can't punish those weak, soft PF on the other end of the floor.
Robinson will be an UFA this off-season, so if they are bringing him for a min? Absolutely "why not?" TRob is slowly starting to show, that maybe he has a place in this League after all. His offense is still very bad though.

Those stretch-guys seem to be our weak spot right now. Hawes caused some problems on the defensive end versus the Clippers. Darell Arthur put up some numbers against us. Markieff got the best out of JT. And there are a lot of those Stretch-4/5-Guys out there around the league. We need to do a better job guarding them.
Well, those guys are usually there to open driving lanes, so it's basically comes down to a trade-off between cutting off penetration and allowing pretty open shots.
 

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
#14
Last night unfolded one of the major weaknesses of this Kings-Roster - defending the penetration from the Guards-Positions. Bledsoe and Dragic abused our Defense time and time again, getting pretty uncontested layups at the rim.
JT, while being a decent post-defender, has problems rotating on help-defense properly and just isn't a shotblocker. On top of that he has problems guarding those stretch-4's, cause he lacks lateral quickness to stay in front of them and has to back off, giving some open jumpers to them. Markieff really hurt us.
In order to balance this roster even further, i would prefer a mobile PF, who can really elevate to block shots and rebound and is quick enough to contest the perimeter game of stretch-4's.
Out of the list above Thomas Robinson fits this bill. He gives the Blazers great hustle, while staying out of the way on offense and using his athleticism on fastbreaks and help-defense. He is a bad post-defender, but versus strong PF's like Love or Griffin the Kings can stick to JT, while Robinson might provide a defensive presence versus those Guard-heavy teams with floor spacing like Phoenix.
His attitude might get into his way, but there are chances that 3 years bouncing around the league without a team really giving him full trust, really cooled some of his temper and made him a bit more humble and realistic.
He should be available at a bargain price, so there isn't much risk involved.
I wrote the original article before the Suns game, but I agree with you that Thompson didn't look particularly effective against the Morris brothers. They were getting the ball in the middle of the floor off pick and rolls and firing mid-range jumpers rather than driving to the basket and we just couldn't stop them with Thompson on the floor. He can body up on anybody in the post, but he has a tendency to sag off and prevent the drive which makes him slow contesting jumpers. Of the guys I mention, Ed Davis and Thomas Robinson look like the affordable options and while I haven't watched the Lakers, I've really been impressed by what I've seen out of Robinson on the Blazers this year. He doesn't play a lot, but he's having an impact when he's on the floor.

Here's a name I think we were linked to in the off season brandon bass.
He's a good pick and role defender and an average man to man defender, and an excellent team defender. Also his ability to hit the mid range shot will cause havoc when teams double DMC. Career shooting from 16-23ft is 46% that's elite for a PF
Brandon Bass is a name I would have probably mentioned but I dismissed him as an option because his rebounding numbers are very poor for a frontcourt player. He's also averaged 11 shots per game for his career and he's not going to get anything close to that in our offense. Landry is giving us post scoring off the bench, I'd rather we stick to low usage guys who have a big impact on the boards in limited minutes.
 
#15
I wrote the original article before the Suns game, but I agree with you that Thompson didn't look particularly effective against the Morris brothers. They were getting the ball in the middle of the floor off pick and rolls and firing mid-range jumpers rather than driving to the basket and we just couldn't stop them with Thompson on the floor. He can body up on anybody in the post, but he has a tendency to sag off and prevent the drive which makes him slow contesting jumpers. Of the guys I mention, Ed Davis and Thomas Robinson look like the affordable options and while I haven't watched the Lakers, I've really been impressed by what I've seen out of Robinson on the Blazers this year. He doesn't play a lot, but he's having an impact when he's on the floor.



Brandon Bass is a name I would have probably mentioned but I dismissed him as an option because his rebounding numbers are very poor for a frontcourt player. He's also averaged 11 shots per game for his career and he's not going to get anything close to that in our offense. Landry is giving us post scoring off the bench, I'd rather we stick to low usage guys who have a big impact on the boards in limited minutes.
His career high in shot attempts is 10.7 and the only time he has been in double digits second highest is 8.8 he knows his role as a vet.
 

bajaden

Hall of Famer
#17
Also... I left out two bargain basement options in Cole Aldrich and Tony Mitchell. Aldrich we all know, and he'll be on the market again this year. Tony Mitchell is actually the guy I wanted us to draft in the second round instead of Ray McCallum but he's only played 79 minutes in the NBA so far, so we don't really know who he is yet. The question then becomes with these two, why not just develop Eric Moreland instead?
My only problem with Mitchell is his size. He's definitely undersized, but he's a terrific athlete. On your other list, the one that interests me the most is Ed Davis. He has all the tools, he's young, and he has the length you look for in a defensive shotblocker. Up to now, he hasn't really gotten many minutes due to playing behind good, and more established players. But, the bottom line is that he's still unproven. I've watched Robinson quite a bit since he left the Kings, and he's done nothing to impress me. His one strength coming out of college was rebounding, and so far, I wouldn't call it a strength. He doesn't block shots, and almost all of his scoring comes at the basket. Sorry, I don't want the dude back. The only problem I have with Sanders is his contract.

This next draft, assuming we have a first round pick, has quite a few potential shotblockers in it. However, if we keep playing the way we are, its a moot point unless we make a deal to acquire a pick.
 
#18
Well it should not be JT OR an athletic, quick held defender, but JT AND this type of player, so that Malone can choose who gets major minutes depending on the matchups and opponents playstyle. We did a good job in the 4th, but Bledsoe and Dragic still got to the rim frequentely. JT had a tough time trying to guard Markieff, who thankfully fouled out. It was Landry, who did a great job closing out on Shooters in overtime.
I guess if this type of player is available for a cheap contract, the Kings can upgrade their roster. Our PF are all somewhat slowfooted. So why not aquire a great athlete for this position, who still develops his game?
In my humble opinion the Kings gave up on Robinson too early. The kid is an athletic freak, who does pretty well for Portland, if given playing time and focusing on hustle plays and running the floor. He clearly took a step forward since his time in SAC and pretty much knows his limits now. Eventually the same narrative like the Casspi-signing might be possible.

You dont need the post-Defense of JT against stretch-4 guys and due to his lack of offensive game, JT can't punish those weak, soft PF on the other end of the floor.
really? rather have robinson over JT so you can chase a few stretch 4's in the L? who's checking the opposing best post player in each of the 5 winning games thus far? if TRob so good why didn't they pick up his option and allowed him to be UFA next season. dude is a undersized scrub. i thought he'd be like a landry but he can't even hold a candle to him. dude is all hustle and doesn't do much other than that. can't believe we blew a lotto pick on that fool.
 

Tetsujin

The Game Thread Dude
#20
no love for john henson?
Good shotblocking. OK outside shooter (his shooting numbers last season are barely better than JT). Bad at actually playing defense (built like a matchstick man with a rather slight lower body). If he were as good a lot of people on these boards seem to think he is, he'd be starting over the shattered husk that is Ersan Ilyasova.
 

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
#21
really? rather have robinson over JT so you can chase a few stretch 4's in the L? who's checking the opposing best post player in each of the 5 winning games thus far? if TRob so good why didn't they pick up his option and allowed him to be UFA next season. dude is a undersized scrub. i thought he'd be like a landry but he can't even hold a candle to him. dude is all hustle and doesn't do much other than that. can't believe we blew a lotto pick on that fool.
Ah there it is, I knew this was coming. :) I hope you at least noticed that the list I came up with at the beginning wasn't a list of players I liked, it was produced through a simple statistical formula. And the numbers Robinson has produced in his limited minutes actually put him in some pretty good company. I think it's worth keeping an eye on his production this season. He might end up being a nice bargain pickup to bolster our bench like Omri was this summer.

Also, with the exception of Sanders and maybe Dieng I don't think any of these guys would be seen as replacements for Thompson.
 

Tetsujin

The Game Thread Dude
#22
Ah there it is, I knew this was coming. :) I hope you at least noticed that the list I came up with at the beginning wasn't a list of players I liked, it was produced through a simple statistical formula. And the numbers Robinson has produced in his limited minutes actually put him in some pretty good company. I think it's worth keeping an eye on his production this season. He might end up being a nice bargain pickup to bolster our bench like Omri was this summer.

Also, with the exception of Sanders and maybe Dieng I don't think any of these guys would be seen as replacements for Thompson.
Except, unlike Omri and just about every signing we've made since Pete took over, T-Rob will never be considered an intelligent basketball player.
 
#23
Those stretch-guys seem to be our weak spot right now. Hawes caused some problems on the defensive end versus the Clippers. Darell Arthur put up some numbers against us. Markieff got the best out of JT. And there are a lot of those Stretch-4/5-Guys out there around the league. We need to do a better job guarding them.
I'd like us to play Landry a lot more minutes against that type of player
 
#24
Meanwhile Moreland waits in the shadows. We have plenty of youth on the roster to help us transition into the future with Ben/Ray/Nik/Moreland but PDA'S job is not done and he knows it. Next season we should be able to sign Rudy at under 19M a year (lol) and let Williams expire, re-sign Evans and still have good flexibility with our cap.
 

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
#25
Except, unlike Omri and just about every signing we've made since Pete took over, T-Rob will never be considered an intelligent basketball player.
Until two weeks ago Ben and Jason had the "basketball IQ" of a turnip, Landry was the walking dead and Collison was a career backup who can't defend anybody. Perceptions have a way of turning out wrong. Remember how Omri Casspi used to be called No-Passpi the last time he was here? He currently has the second highest assist % on the team. All I'm saying is that if you look at the numbers, Robinson is getting results in exactly the areas where we could use some more depth on the bench. He's also young enough to potentially grow into a starting role. I'm not saying he's my first choice, but if you look past your initial impressions, he might be one of the better future potential vs current production bargains on the free agent market this year.
 

VF21

Super Moderator Emeritus
SME
#26
Until two weeks ago Ben and Jason had the "basketball IQ" of a turnip, Landry was the walking dead and Collison was a career backup who can't defend anybody. Perceptions have a way of turning out wrong. Remember how Omri Casspi used to be called No-Passpi the last time he was here? He currently has the second highest assist % on the team. All I'm saying is that if you look at the numbers, Robinson is getting results in exactly the areas where we could use some more depth on the bench. He's also young enough to potentially grow into a starting role. I'm not saying he's my first choice, but if you look past your initial impressions, he might be one of the better future potential vs current production bargains on the free agent market this year.
Actually, I just did a quick search. It appears as though that particular term was only used a couple of times, primarily by Kingsguy881.
 

hrdboild

Moloch in whom I dream Angels!
Staff member
#27
Actually, I just did a quick search. It appears as though that particular term was only used a couple of times, primarily by Kingsguy881.
I think if you go back and re-read some of the discussions that went on at the time Casspi was traded or just prior to that with the Donte Greene vs. Omri Casspi debates in 2011 and 2012 you would agree that the perception of Omri Casspi as a borderline selfish player or at the very least a poor passer and a detriment to ball movement was a lot more widespread than just one guy. The nickname itself may have been used more on other message boards, I can't recall now. I was referring more to the implications of the nickname than the name itself. Point being we had Omri on the team as a rookie and he spent a few years kicking around the league and learning the ropes while adding to his skillset. He's returned with a better idea of who he is as a player and how he can contribute on a winning team. That may or may not be true of Thomas Robinson, but you have to admit that better leadership has done wonders for everyone else on this team.
 
#28
I think if you go back and re-read some of the discussions that went on at the time Casspi was traded or just prior to that with the Donte Greene vs. Omri Casspi debates in 2011 and 2012 you would agree that the perception of Omri Casspi as a borderline selfish player or at the very least a poor passer and a detriment to ball movement was a lot more widespread than just one guy. The nickname itself may have been used more on other message boards, I can't recall now. I was referring more to the implications of the nickname than the name itself. Point being we had Omri on the team as a rookie and he spent a few years kicking around the league and learning the ropes while adding to his skillset. He's returned with a better idea of who he is as a player and how he can contribute on a winning team. That may or may not be true of Thomas Robinson, but you have to admit that better leadership has done wonders for everyone else on this team.
Pretty much sums it up correctly. If you watch Portland, you don't see those mental breakdowns from Robinson anymore. You don't see a whole lot of those rushed plays, dribblings or jumpshots anymore, which bothered him in his debut season with the Kings. He is just focusing on the things he can do and thats using his athleticism. And one can't deny, that TRob is a superior athlete.
I dont know much about the upcoming draft, so I can only judge, what might be available via FA or trade for the Kings. TRob on a bargain contract is worth thinking about.
 
#29
Draymond Green will be a f/a after this year. Fun player to watch and root for, he kinda reminds me of Artest the way he can anchor a defense with his tenacious energy.
His energy is infectious, defense is close to elite, can guard multiple positions, knock down the three at a high rate, and would make us even more dangerous on the boards.
 
K

KingMilz

Guest
#30
Pretty much sums it up correctly. If you watch Portland, you don't see those mental breakdowns from Robinson anymore. You don't see a whole lot of those rushed plays, dribblings or jumpshots anymore, which bothered him in his debut season with the Kings. He is just focusing on the things he can do and thats using his athleticism. And one can't deny, that TRob is a superior athlete.
I dont know much about the upcoming draft, so I can only judge, what might be available via FA or trade for the Kings. TRob on a bargain contract is worth thinking about.
While you don't see any of those things you still don't see anything that made him a #5 pick which means you still don't see much at all, T-Rob still sucks. T-Rob would not beat out any of our current bigs on the roster, hell I'm not sure he would beat out Moreland if both were given the same chance to play.
 
K

KingMilz

Guest
#30
Pretty much sums it up correctly. If you watch Portland, you don't see those mental breakdowns from Robinson anymore. You don't see a whole lot of those rushed plays, dribblings or jumpshots anymore, which bothered him in his debut season with the Kings. He is just focusing on the things he can do and thats using his athleticism. And one can't deny, that TRob is a superior athlete.
I dont know much about the upcoming draft, so I can only judge, what might be available via FA or trade for the Kings. TRob on a bargain contract is worth thinking about.
While you don't see any of those things you still don't see anything that made him a #5 pick which means you still don't see much at all, T-Rob still sucks. T-Rob would not beat out any of our current bigs on the roster, hell I'm not sure he would beat out Moreland if both were given the same chance to play.