Current Team Discussion and Possible Trades
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Shutdown all your trade ideas. Our 2nd best asset now is probably Koufos. Long(er) term-deal, cheap contract, in his prime, and solid on both ends. This is so horrible. We should've traded Rudy by now. I don't understand this organization. What exactly are we trying to accomplish right now? What can we accomplish without Rudy?
This is such a big hit to our team. Unbelievable at this point.
This is such a big hit to our team. Unbelievable at this point.
We should have traded Rudy in the offseason. We should have signed FAs, that are in their prime or about to enter it and fit our profile instead of opting for Barnes, Afflalo and Tolliver. But we can't change the past. So no use to argue about that.
From here on out the FO needs to come up with some creative solutions. We need to find a way to get players, who help us win, without anything of true value left on the roster. Wether we manage to aquire a player with untapped potential in a trade or find some diamond in the rough in the D-League, China or Europe doesn't matter - we somehow need to move on from this mess. And finding value where nobody else expects it, is really our only option right now.
Cavs found Liggins. Memphis found Harrison, Ennis or Williams. Warriors found Holiday a few seasons ago. Spurs found Simmons. So finding something of value without high draft picks or big trades is possible. No excuses not to try it.
But first of all we need to find a working identity for this team to move forward. If we want to keep Cuz and want to give him the big bucks, we need to find a promising formula how a winning roster built around him should look like.
From here on out the FO needs to come up with some creative solutions. We need to find a way to get players, who help us win, without anything of true value left on the roster. Wether we manage to aquire a player with untapped potential in a trade or find some diamond in the rough in the D-League, China or Europe doesn't matter - we somehow need to move on from this mess. And finding value where nobody else expects it, is really our only option right now.
Cavs found Liggins. Memphis found Harrison, Ennis or Williams. Warriors found Holiday a few seasons ago. Spurs found Simmons. So finding something of value without high draft picks or big trades is possible. No excuses not to try it.
But first of all we need to find a working identity for this team to move forward. If we want to keep Cuz and want to give him the big bucks, we need to find a promising formula how a winning roster built around him should look like.
K
It is beyond frustrating. One mess after another. Letting IT go was one of the worst moves in the history of the NBA. Then fast forward to the WCS pick and this past year's draft disaster, the inability to sign good FAs, and the inability to get any type of trade done that betters this franchise. For those who thought the 76ers trade was a magic gift from god, you see now. This franchise is in trouble.
This seems to be a bit of a confusion. I'm not sure what was in Gay's contract, if anything, or what CD said about the contract, as I can't find anybody else repeating it. What Dude was talking about above is the NBA's Disabled Player Exception, which is no longer available after 1/15. The DPE allows a team that is above the cap to sign a free agent (or trade for an expiring player) who, in this case, could make up to the MLE, for the rest of the year. But since we don't have a roster spot, we would have had to clear a roster spot - perhaps by waiving Rudy, in order to take advantage of the DPE anyhow.
If anything, this prevents us from having the incentive to make a (possibly) bad decision. If we were to waive Rudy, his player option would automatically vest, and be stretched across the three seasons from 2017-18 to 2019-20. But there's a chance that Rudy might opt out - not a very good chance, but a chance. Furthermore, there's a chance that he could rehab and return to health quickly like Wes Matthews and MAYBE somebody will want to trade for him at the deadline next year. I think both of those are very low probability events, but something more than zero, which is what we would get if we waived him to sign a replacement (and who?)
If anything, this prevents us from having the incentive to make a (possibly) bad decision. If we were to waive Rudy, his player option would automatically vest, and be stretched across the three seasons from 2017-18 to 2019-20. But there's a chance that Rudy might opt out - not a very good chance, but a chance. Furthermore, there's a chance that he could rehab and return to health quickly like Wes Matthews and MAYBE somebody will want to trade for him at the deadline next year. I think both of those are very low probability events, but something more than zero, which is what we would get if we waived him to sign a replacement (and who?)
I don't see any indication that the DPE frees a roster spot, though it might be so. I suspect the Grizz were taking advantage of the NBA hardship exception, which allows a team to get an extra roster slot if four players are all long-term injured. We only have one long-term injury right now, so we wouldn't qualify for that.
Vlade is a dipcrap. That Philly trade is horrible right now.
When will it be ok to call for his head? None of his moves since coming in at GM have netted positive results. I know it's only been 1 and 1/2 years as his tenure at GM, but in that short time span, the guy already destroyed 1 future asset in 2018/2019, and maybe another one this year.
I don't understand what he was trying to accomplish with our draft. I also don't understand what he was trying to accomplish with our FA. Somehow, the Kings are constantly talking about playoffs. Maybe Vlade should've rethought that when he drafted 3 guys who's only impact this season has been taking up 3 roster spots. I don't know how far we'll be able to get into playoff talks when there's a legitimate argument that Matt Barnes is our 3rd best player, maybe Temple? No disrespect to those guys, but they are at best, scrappy NBA bench players.
This team is not very good.
When will it be ok to call for his head? None of his moves since coming in at GM have netted positive results. I know it's only been 1 and 1/2 years as his tenure at GM, but in that short time span, the guy already destroyed 1 future asset in 2018/2019, and maybe another one this year.
I don't understand what he was trying to accomplish with our draft. I also don't understand what he was trying to accomplish with our FA. Somehow, the Kings are constantly talking about playoffs. Maybe Vlade should've rethought that when he drafted 3 guys who's only impact this season has been taking up 3 roster spots. I don't know how far we'll be able to get into playoff talks when there's a legitimate argument that Matt Barnes is our 3rd best player, maybe Temple? No disrespect to those guys, but they are at best, scrappy NBA bench players.
This team is not very good.
I have been critical as anybody else on Vlade. I think he got caught with his pants down in the Philly trade. It was horrible anyway you look at it. However, the team has been devoid of talent even before Vlade took over. He exacerbated the situation by giving up an unprotected 1st round pick along with draft swaps. I think he realized after that trade and last season that draft picks are critical to small market teams, even if you suck at drafting. He then went out an traded Marco for a draft pick and traded down to alleviate the traded draft pick.
Free agency was typical as a Kings fan. Mediocre players, but I suspect Vlade had a vision to sign mediocre players who will act as stop gaps while the young players develop. In doing so, he also wanted field a team with veterans that would compete and play hard while keeping the team moderately competitive, not necessarily wins and losses. The Kings cap situation looks better than most teams a couple of years from now when the Kings can finally surround DMC with 3&D players like the should have done years back and hopefully one of the youngsters blossoms into a contributor.
Going into the year, I knew we would be bad. I think most of the disappointment stems from the fanbase exaggerating the effect Joeger would have on the team. Fans hyped this team way too much. Maybe in the 90'-00's this team would be better, but not presently with the way the game is played.
Free agency was typical as a Kings fan. Mediocre players, but I suspect Vlade had a vision to sign mediocre players who will act as stop gaps while the young players develop. In doing so, he also wanted field a team with veterans that would compete and play hard while keeping the team moderately competitive, not necessarily wins and losses. The Kings cap situation looks better than most teams a couple of years from now when the Kings can finally surround DMC with 3&D players like the should have done years back and hopefully one of the youngsters blossoms into a contributor.
Going into the year, I knew we would be bad. I think most of the disappointment stems from the fanbase exaggerating the effect Joeger would have on the team. Fans hyped this team way too much. Maybe in the 90'-00's this team would be better, but not presently with the way the game is played.
Deadline Deals
1. Darren Collison & Omri Casspi for Kelly Oubre & Trey Burke
2. Garrett Temple & Ty Lawson for Cameron Payne & Anthony Morrow
3. Ben McLemore for 2nd Round Pick
Draft Day Deal
1. Kosta Koufos for Late 1st/Early 2nd Round Pick
Roster to Finish Out 2016-17 Season
PG - Payne / Burke
SG - Richardson / Afflalo / Morrow
SF - Oubre / Barnes / Gay
PF - Cauley-Stein / Labissiere / Tolliver
C - Cousins / Koufos / Papagiannis
That leaves us with approximately $23.8 mil in cap space. We sign Bogdanovic to around $8 mil, that leaves us with $15.8 mil in cap space. However, we wouldn't have any roster spots available to sign anyone else (Cousins, Gay, Afflalo, Tolliver, Bogdanovic, Barnes, Cauley-Stein, Papagiannis, Payne, Oubre, Richardson, Labissiere, SAC 1st, pick from Koufos trade, & pick from McLemore trade). If we want, we could waive Afflalo and have enough cap space to max out a RFA (like Porter). Long shot he would do it but it's nice to have that flexibility in case we can make it happen. If we just keep the 15 above, our team would look like this for the 2017-18 season:
2017-18 Roster
PG - Payne
SG - Bogdanovic / Richardson / Afflalo
SF - Oubre / Barnes / Gay
PF - Cauley-Stein / Labissiere / Tolliver
C - Cousins / Papagiannis
***SAC 2017 1st, 2017 pick from Koufos trade, & 2017 pick from McLemore trade***
We probably wouldn't be very competitive this year either, so our 2018 pick would most likely end up in the lottery giving us another chance at a good player. With Gay, Afflalo, Tolliver, & Barnes expiring & Cousins signing his max extension, we'd have approximately $41.4 mil in cap space with this roster:
2018-19 Roster
PG - Payne
SG - Bogdanovic / Richardson
SF - Oubre
PF - Cauley-Stein / Labissiere
C - Cousins / Papagiannis
***SAC 2017 1st, 2017 pick from Koufos trade, 2017 pick from McLemore trade, & SAC 2018 1st***
Notable FAs in the 2018 offseason that we can go after with our $41.4 mil cap space would be:
Will Barton
Avery Bradley
Danny Green
Gary Harris
Rodney Hood
Zach LaVine
Kyle Anderson
Paul George
Doug McDermott
TJ Warren
Andrew Wiggins
Aaron Gordon
Jabari Parker
Julius Randle
Noah Vonleh
Derrick Favors
1. Darren Collison & Omri Casspi for Kelly Oubre & Trey Burke
2. Garrett Temple & Ty Lawson for Cameron Payne & Anthony Morrow
3. Ben McLemore for 2nd Round Pick
Draft Day Deal
1. Kosta Koufos for Late 1st/Early 2nd Round Pick
Roster to Finish Out 2016-17 Season
PG - Payne / Burke
SG - Richardson / Afflalo / Morrow
SF - Oubre / Barnes / Gay
PF - Cauley-Stein / Labissiere / Tolliver
C - Cousins / Koufos / Papagiannis
That leaves us with approximately $23.8 mil in cap space. We sign Bogdanovic to around $8 mil, that leaves us with $15.8 mil in cap space. However, we wouldn't have any roster spots available to sign anyone else (Cousins, Gay, Afflalo, Tolliver, Bogdanovic, Barnes, Cauley-Stein, Papagiannis, Payne, Oubre, Richardson, Labissiere, SAC 1st, pick from Koufos trade, & pick from McLemore trade). If we want, we could waive Afflalo and have enough cap space to max out a RFA (like Porter). Long shot he would do it but it's nice to have that flexibility in case we can make it happen. If we just keep the 15 above, our team would look like this for the 2017-18 season:
2017-18 Roster
PG - Payne
SG - Bogdanovic / Richardson / Afflalo
SF - Oubre / Barnes / Gay
PF - Cauley-Stein / Labissiere / Tolliver
C - Cousins / Papagiannis
***SAC 2017 1st, 2017 pick from Koufos trade, & 2017 pick from McLemore trade***
We probably wouldn't be very competitive this year either, so our 2018 pick would most likely end up in the lottery giving us another chance at a good player. With Gay, Afflalo, Tolliver, & Barnes expiring & Cousins signing his max extension, we'd have approximately $41.4 mil in cap space with this roster:
2018-19 Roster
PG - Payne
SG - Bogdanovic / Richardson
SF - Oubre
PF - Cauley-Stein / Labissiere
C - Cousins / Papagiannis
***SAC 2017 1st, 2017 pick from Koufos trade, 2017 pick from McLemore trade, & SAC 2018 1st***
Notable FAs in the 2018 offseason that we can go after with our $41.4 mil cap space would be:
Will Barton
Avery Bradley
Danny Green
Gary Harris
Rodney Hood
Zach LaVine
Kyle Anderson
Paul George
Doug McDermott
TJ Warren
Andrew Wiggins
Aaron Gordon
Jabari Parker
Julius Randle
Noah Vonleh
Derrick Favors
K
I was actually going to post the other day a trade for Kelly Obrue JR which was DC/WCS/Casspi for him and Nicholson but I thought there was no way the Wizards would have any incentive to do it, but yeah I'm 100% on the Obrue JR bandwagon. Ben for a 2nd round pick is the only one I can see getting done out of those 3.
I could see both WAS and OKC turning down the deals.
The WAS deal was to help them win now considering they are starting to come around (5th seed) and only 3 games back from the 3rd seed. Their starting lineup has been stellar this year (+12.5 net rtg), but their team net rtg this year is +0.1. Their bench has been killing them this year. Collison and Casspi would help their bench tremendously. Collison, Casspi, & Mahinmi (when healthy) is the start of a good bench. I would probably bring Gortat off the bench to be honest considering Mahinmi's defense is better and they already have Wall, Beal, Porter, & Morris who can score in the starting lineup.
The OKC deal was again to help them win now. Lawson brings more to the table than Payne right now, and there were talks about Gay for Payne, so I was thinking that a cheaper player on a longer contract would hold similar value considering he has proven to be a good 3&D player this year. It also gives them flexibility in making Roberson available in trades considering they don't want to give him a big payday as a RFA next year.
The WAS deal was to help them win now considering they are starting to come around (5th seed) and only 3 games back from the 3rd seed. Their starting lineup has been stellar this year (+12.5 net rtg), but their team net rtg this year is +0.1. Their bench has been killing them this year. Collison and Casspi would help their bench tremendously. Collison, Casspi, & Mahinmi (when healthy) is the start of a good bench. I would probably bring Gortat off the bench to be honest considering Mahinmi's defense is better and they already have Wall, Beal, Porter, & Morris who can score in the starting lineup.
The OKC deal was again to help them win now. Lawson brings more to the table than Payne right now, and there were talks about Gay for Payne, so I was thinking that a cheaper player on a longer contract would hold similar value considering he has proven to be a good 3&D player this year. It also gives them flexibility in making Roberson available in trades considering they don't want to give him a big payday as a RFA next year.
I'm not doubting that. I'd probably start with just Collison & Casspi but I'd be willing to end with Cauley-Stein thrown into the mix. So we're in agreement there.
Oubre/Satoransky/Burke for Collison/Casspi/Cauley-Stein is the deal I'd be willing to land on. I'd like to maximize our 2018-19 cap space when we have Gay, Afflalo, Tolliver, & Barnes coming off the books. Nicholson's contract would cut into that a bit while Satoransky would only be $3 mil which is a doable contract for a good 3rd PG.
Oubre/Satoransky/Burke for Collison/Casspi/Cauley-Stein is the deal I'd be willing to land on. I'd like to maximize our 2018-19 cap space when we have Gay, Afflalo, Tolliver, & Barnes coming off the books. Nicholson's contract would cut into that a bit while Satoransky would only be $3 mil which is a doable contract for a good 3rd PG.
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